Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[tkitna]

Why don't Paul collaborate with somebody on lyrics?!

[An Apple Beatle]

Paul needs a lyrical oppo. lol... How about Roger Waters? That might bring some balance. A bit of light and dark. lol...I don't mean it, just throwing wood to the fire. hehehehe

[Bobber]

I guess I'm one of the few that really like "Flowers In The Dirt", but 'You Want Her Too' with Mr. McManus is pretty excruciating, and Hamish Stuart's vocals were horrible on "Tripping...".

[adamzero]

It was a shame that Elvis and Paul didn't come together for something really classic.  I like both of them so much, but it just didn't happen.  Elvis did a better job with Burt Bachrach, but even that album sounds kinda like an exercise now.

I hear you, tkitna, but maybe Superman does need an Aquaman now and then.  (Couldn't Aquaman get the whales and giant squids to do his bidding?)  I guess that's what I find most disturbing about Paul.  How can you go from writing "Eleanor Rigby" and "Penny Lane" and "Blackbird" to writing this stuff nowadays.  

It's like he forgot creative writing 101.  Use images!  Go in fear of abstractions.  If he'd quit trying to write Michael Jackson style message songs and just write a bunch of songs full of images and odd scouse references (finger-pie, etc.) he'd do a million times better.

I don't know.  I just don't know.  

[tkitna]

I think he concentrates on the music first and the lyrics secondly. I'm the same way. As long as the music is good, I really dont care whats being said in the song.

[tkitna]

I guess I'm one of the few that really like "Flowers In The Dirt", but 'You Want Her Too' with Mr. McManus is pretty excruciating, and Hamish Stuart's vocals were horrible on "Tripping...".

Count me as one of the few also. I like 'FITD' a lot, but its a 'music listening cd' and not one you throw on during the party.

Hamish is vocally challenged.

It's like he forgot creative writing 101.

[Mairi]

Go easy there jr, he was just voicing his opinion. You're allowed to disagree but don't bring insults into it.

[adamzero]

Sorry for the rubber leg thing, JR.  I just heard the impish voice of a young John Lennon in my head saying something non-PC like that.  

Sorry if I came off pompous--didn't intend that.  By criticizing Paul, I would not say that I'm better than he is as a songwriter or musician.  If that were the case nobody on this board could criticize anything he's ever written.  Because no one here (at least I think) is his equal in that capacity.  Unless Dylan or Neil Young or Brian Wilson or a couple other folks are lurking out there.  

But I don't think the fact that Paul's been prolific is a defense for lyrical sloppiness.  Or being lyrically boring.  That was the point of my rubber leg jab.  It hits you in the face. It's not afraid to insult you.  It isn't just "music."  

My point is that Paul has gone from a very high level of lyrical prowess to his current "place."  

I maintain my major point.  The lyrics don't seem "vital" the way his lyrics did in the 60s.  Neil Young's still writing vital lyrics--so is Dylan.  If Paul wants to be on their level he's going to have to do better than "A Fine Line."

Is this the man's accumulated wisdom of however many years?  

JR, I don't say this to be combative or insulting to you.  Just to converse.  I always value your input.  I hope you accept my apology as well as anyone else who might have been offended.

Go easy there jr, he was just voicing his opinion. You're allowed to disagree but don't bring insults into it.

I don't mind people's opinions. A forum is a give and take, but I take offense to the fact that someone's disability is used for tasteless humor. I don't particularly care for Heather, and no matter what fault I would or could find with her, I would never stoop to making tasteless asides about her physical impediment(s).

[adamzero]

Sorry again, JR.  I promise, no more rubber-leg jokes.  

But let's face the facts, the more mediocre music McCartney puts out the more he builds the case that maybe he wasn't the genius of the Beatles after all.  And frankly, Mr Shankly, I think that's sad.  

But age should have nothing to do with creativity.  

Did they say about Beethoven--that 9th symphony, boy, he's sure getting on . . . and deaf to boot . . . not near as good as the 1st and 3rd and 5th!

Plenty of bluesmen recorded some of their best stuff in their 60s.  Muddy Waters, Howlin' Wolf.  

Yeats wrote his greatest poems after 60.  Thomas Hardy did into his 80s.

Paul shouldn't get a walk just because he was a beatle and we feel nostalgia.  His stuff now is just plain mediocre.  There's no core, no vision.  

I find that disturbing.  Especially for one you say who changed the world.  

I think that's the real problem with pop culture--we invest these people with mythic, almost religious status--we call them icons--when they really don't have the depth or vision or transcendence to deserve such status.

As Graham Parker put it, "It's a strange religion, without any God!"

So people feel obliged to pay homage to the ghost of Beatle Paul (1965-68) by expecting that same sense of wonder and transcendence we felt with those classic songs.  

But he's just not writing them anymore.  Hasn't been for a long time.  So don't tell me I don't have a right to criticize when he has the right to foist this stuff upon the public and let loose the publicity machines and let us all know he's "back."

He's not coming back.  He's lost the gift.  And it just plain sad.  

And, JR, I don't mind being called "ignorant" and a "f***", but "pompous"--that really hurts.  

There's an interesting parallel between your view and your posts.  According to you, Paul was once an innovator, one with vision and a creative force, now, and for some time, he has been hitting his nadir with mediocre material/output.  You come across as a fairly erudite, literate person, yet you downshift into the mundane, if not downright base, with a comment about someone with a disability. You, yourself have shown that writing material, whether its song or post, can go from creative and interesting to unimaginative and/or lacking purpose all at the same time.

[adamzero]

Guilty as charged.

But then aren't we all?

[An Apple Beatle]

Lol...You guys!!!! hehehe....Some really good points. I gotta say that timing and condition of life come into play in terms of creativity.

Beethoven could mathematically write scores in his head...Not really a comparison.

Muddy and Howlin' Wolf would never have sounded so definitive if they were much younger.

Yeat's and Hardy? Poems are words, there's music to limit that freedom of vocabulary to think about in this comparison.

Most your other points are pretty well cased apart from narrowing Paul to 65/66 unless your referring to the Paul is dead myth. He has had some saving graces in his solo career. I'm not a big fan of him solo but that has to be acknowledged.

Anyway, he was one of the one'S that changed the world. To suggest he did so alone would be silly. lol

I value both your opinions on this and AZ graciously retracted the limb thing. Just thought my 2-penneth should go in.

I think its a preposterous notion that people should, or are even able to, keep progressing creatively until when? Death? Maybe Mr. Zero can produce an album each year for us to critique and see how far he can go. Macca has made his mark. He enjoys creating music. So what if its not earth-shattering, consciousness altering, groundbreaking material. I say bully for him, he's doing what he loves. Eric Clapton continues to produce 'nice' records with the same nice guitar licks. Elton John releases basically the same album every few years (though his last one was pretty good, but hardly revolutionary), the list goes on. Listen to whatever music of Paul's you like, and let the rest go. Its usually the people that can't play "Chopsticks" on a piano that are the quickest to find fault with brilliant musicians. Makes them feel important or something. And it is pompous to suggest to anyone what they should or shouldn't create.

[Mairi]

Mmhm, I agree. If John was alive today, do you think he'd still be churning out Imagines every couple of years?
Even DF was, well... not that... earth-shattering.

[An Apple Beatle]

I look forward to his next peak...If it don't happen this time? Theres plenty of back catalogue to be enjoyin. Simple as that for me.

I look forward to his next peak...If it don't happen this time? Theres plenty of back catalogue to be enjoyin. Simple as that for me.

Amen, Bruthu'.

[In Blue Hawaii]

I look forward to his next peak...If it don't happen this time?

I think this is Paul in EXTREMELY top form man. The single is pretty darn good. I find it TREMENDOUSLY interesting, especially the chords over the long coda, and the middle break, and the driving quality of the arrangement, and the piano, and the strings, and the backing harmonies, and the lyrics (yes yes), and the performance. Oh, and the tambo that comes in at the end..and this is  just the FIRST song.

I think this album is it. I don't know how well it will go over commercially, but I think we'll be talking about it for some time. Excellent album cover too.