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Author Topic: Beatles 'Firsts'  (Read 19025 times)

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zipp

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #40 on: March 03, 2007, 09:45:59 AM »

Quote from: 185
Were they the first band to deliberately miss-spell their name (The Monkees, The Byrds etc)? I can think of no others before them.

You may well be right.
They're probably also the first group whose individual members also had number one records in the USA ... even Ringo had two!
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Kevin

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #41 on: March 03, 2007, 10:06:42 AM »

Quote from: 185
Were they the first band to deliberately miss-spell their name (The Monkees, The Byrds etc)? I can think of no others before them.

Actually, thinking about it now, it's not a big deal. Because they were the most famous band in the world their decision re spelling (and not really a misspell either I guess) kicked off a trend. If they hadn't become famous no one else would have done it and it would have meant zilch.
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mr kite

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #42 on: March 03, 2007, 11:03:13 AM »

First group to make films that were really good  8)
Where they the first group to have there own label [apple]  :-/
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Kevin

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #43 on: March 03, 2007, 11:12:03 AM »

Quote from: 449
Where they the first group to have there own label [apple]  :-/

Could be. It's a sign of how times change that what was supposed to be a hippy cooperative has morphed into one of the worlds leading marketting money making corporations. Maggie's Farm won the day.
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BlueMeanie

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #44 on: March 03, 2007, 11:12:53 AM »

Quote from: 449
First group to make films that were really good  8)
Where they the first group to have there own label [apple]  :-/

Apple was just a front really, seeing as they were contracted to EMI.

First band to have a front!
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BlueMeanie

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #45 on: March 03, 2007, 11:13:51 AM »

I'll get me coat.
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Kevin

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #46 on: March 03, 2007, 12:12:57 PM »

NOTE: THINKING ALOUD ONLY
All this Beatles Firsts stuff has got me athinkin.
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GreenApple

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #47 on: March 03, 2007, 12:35:45 PM »

With the tape loop of Ringo's drums in Tomorrow Never Knows, were they the first band to sample/tape loop music for a song?
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Kevin

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #48 on: March 03, 2007, 12:39:39 PM »

Quote from: 139
With the tape loop of Ringo's drums in Tomorrow Never Knows, were they the first band to sample/tape loop music for a song?

From Wiki
"Sampling existing (copyrighted) recordings using manipulation with tape recorders goes back at least as far as 1961, when James Tenney created Collage #1 ("Blue Suede") from samples of Elvis Presley's recording of the song Blue Suede Shoes."
Mind you, that's a little different (and a lot less innovative) than taking a sample from one song and inserting it into another.
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GreenApple

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #49 on: March 03, 2007, 12:58:59 PM »

Quote from: 185

From Wiki
"Sampling existing (copyrighted) recordings using manipulation with tape recorders goes back at least as far as 1961, when James Tenney created Collage #1 ("Blue Suede") from samples of Elvis Presley's recording of the song Blue Suede Shoes."
Mind you, that's a little different (and a lot less innovative) than taking a sample from one song and inserting it into another.

Thought there might be an exemption. But, of course, they never took it from a different song.
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zipp

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #50 on: March 03, 2007, 01:48:03 PM »

Quote from: 185
1.I wonder if, because we are all so enamoured by them, that we attach undue importance to their innovations.

2. And do most of these firsts really match the true trend setting innovations
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wingsman

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #51 on: November 09, 2007, 10:54:52 AM »

1. First artist to spent over 50 consecutive weeks at #1 in the UK album charts (Please Please Me + With the Beatles = 51)
2. First artist to replace themselves at #1 in the US singles charts twice consecutively (I Want to Hold Your Hand, and then She Loves You, and then Can't Buy Me Love!)
3. First and only artist to have 6 #1 singles in a single year in the US (1964) (plus 2 #2's!)
4. First artist occuping the first 5 chart positions in the US charts. (During the week of April 4, 1964 The Beatles occupied #1 - "Can't Buy Me Love," #2 - "Twist and Shout," #3 - "She Loves You," #4 - "I Want to Hold Your Hand" and #5 - "Please Please Me")

 ;)
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Kevin

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #52 on: November 19, 2007, 05:33:28 PM »

Quote from: 960
Beatles firsts

The Beatles combined folk with rock before the Byrds as admitted by Roger McGuinn

Ok: this is what McGuinn actually said:
( He doesn't say they combined folk and rock. He says they inspired him and that he could hear similar chord structures in their music to folk (on She Loves You and I Want To Hold Your Hand no less.). I don't think it counts becasuse they had absolutely no idea or intention to combine the two.
So no, they didn't combine folk and rock. (least of all on the two songs cited.)


"Roger McGuinn on the Beatles and Folk Rock"
At the same time all this was happening, McGuinn also experienced a major epiphany that would have a profound effect on his musical future: The Beatles had exploded onto the American charts. Captivated by their skiffle beat, mellifluous chord progressions, and infectious melodies, he instinctively knew that melding those distinguishing characteristics with his own tried-and-true folk sensibilities and training would yield a pretty unique sound.

"When the Beatles had come out, the folk boom had already peaked," McGuinn notes. "The people who had been into it were getting kind of burned out. It just wasn't very gratifying, and it had become so commercial that it had lost its meaning for a lot of people. So the Beatles kind of re-energized it for me. I thought it was natural to put the Beatles' beat and the energy of the Beatles into folk music. And in fact, I heard folk chord changes in the Beatles' music when I listened to their early stuff like 'She Loves You' and 'I Want To Hold Your Hand.' I could hear the passing chords that we always use in folk music: the G-Em-Am-B kind of stuff. So I really think the Beatles invented folk-rock. They just didn't know it."
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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #53 on: November 19, 2007, 05:38:33 PM »

Quote from: 410


Roger McGuinn founded the Byrds after he'd seen A Hard Day's Night.The Beatles inspired people like Simon and Garfunkel and Dylan (with their thoughtful lyrics) to go electric.This in turn inspired the Byrds.
.At first the Stones were an r'n'b band.They had no songs of their own.The Beatles more or less got them a record company and gave them their first hit.



As far as S&G and The Byrds (both folk roots), I think it was Dylan going electric at the Newport Jazz Festival in 1965 that had a lot to do w/ the Yank folkies really plugging in. Granted, McGuinn was inspired to use his 12-string after seeing AHDN, but I really believe it was Zimmerman's ballsiness and turning his back on the early folk "purists" to use an electric guitar at this famous "acoustic only" jazz event that really made the difference.

and...Andrew Oldham secured the Stones record deal.


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BlueMeanie

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #54 on: November 19, 2007, 05:40:30 PM »

Quote from: 960
Beatles firsts

The Beatles combined folk with rock before the Byrds as admitted by Roger McGuinn
A Hard Days Night- jangle pop again before the Byrds
Country Rock- I Don't Want to Spoil the Party years before in was popular
Intentional Guitar Feedback- I Feel Fine.
Guitar Drone- Ticket to Ride months before See My Friends
Yesterday- string quartet- chamber type rock
She A

Welcome to the forums SAL. Now, let's deal with your list!

'The Beatles combined folk with rock before the Byrds'. - I don't hear any folk music. It's not folk just because it's acoustic you know.

'A Hard Days Night- jangle pop again before the Byrds' - Never really seen that song as 'jangle pop'. Where's the jangle?

'Intentional Guitar Feedback- I Feel Fine.' - Many people had already experimented with feedback.

'Yesterday- string quartet- chamber type rock', - For a start Yesterday isn't a rock song. Secondly, a string quartet doesn't constitute 'chamber'. It's a ballad sung to the accompaniment of strings. I think that style had been around for years.

Sorry to knock you off your perch on your first post! ;) Do join in and have fun.
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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #55 on: November 19, 2007, 05:42:54 PM »

The Beatles were the first to have "proteges" to go on to fame and glory themselves (e.g., Badfinger, Mary Hopkin, James Taylor (due to his Peter Asher connection), Jackie Lomax (to a lesser degree)
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BlueMeanie

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #56 on: November 19, 2007, 05:56:15 PM »

Quote from: 829
The Beatles were the first to have "proteges" to go on to fame and glory themselves (e.g., Badfinger, Mary Hopkin, James Taylor (due to his Peter Asher connection), Jackie Lomax (to a lesser degree)

Good point, though I think Jackie Lomax was only moderately well known by association.
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SAL

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #57 on: November 19, 2007, 06:03:32 PM »

Beatles firsts.

I Want to Hold Your Hand- first Merseybeat number one song in America
Folk Rock- The Byrds went electric because of the Beatles
Jangle Pop- A Hard Days Night again before the Byrds
Country Rock- I Don't Want to Spoil the Party years before in was popular
Intentional Guitar Feedback- I Feel Fine.
Guitar Drone- Ticket to Ride months before See My Friends
Yesterday- string quartet- chamber type rock
She A Woman- early ska influenced song
Eight Days A Week- first fade in
It's Only Love- one the first songs with guitar through leslie speaker
Norwegian Wood- first raga folk rock song
Norwegian Wood- first song released with sitar
The Word- The first hippie universal love song.
Rain- The first song with backward fade out
Rain- The first song with backward music put into a mix.
Tomorrow Never Knows- Maybe the first progressive rock song
Tomorrow Never Knows- The first song with tamboura drone
Tomorrow Never Knows- The first song with backward guitar solo
Tomorrow Never Knows- The first song that uses Automatic double tracking
Tomorrow Never Knows- The first song that uses vocals through a leslie speaker
Tomorrow Never Knows- Maybe the first song to use mellotron
Tomorrow Never Knows- The first song to uses extensive use of tape loops
Love You To- The first song to combine classical Indian with Rock.
Docter Robert- The first country- acid influenced song?
Revolver- The first progressive rock album?
Eleanor Rigby- The first song with no rock instruments with just string backing and vocals.
Eleanor Rigby- uses up close miking.
Think For Yourself- uses two basses one regular, the other bass distortion that acts as a lead guitar.
I'm Only Sleeping- backward guitar riffs
Strawberry Fields Forever- avante classical with rock
Strawberry Fields Forever- first song to use double fade-out
Strawberrry Fields Forever- first song to use reserve effects on drums
A Day in the Life- first symphomic prog song
Within You Without You- First Indian Prog song
Within You Withou You- first song written using Eastern religious beliefs
Sgt Pepper first album with no long pauses between tracks
Sgt. Pepper first album with printed lyrics
Sgt Innver Groove- first hidden track?
Lucy in the Sky With Diamond- first song with phasing?
Sgt Pepper Reprse- the first reprise song in rock.
All You Need Is Love- first song in 7/8 to go number one.
I am the Walrus- first song to use live sampling.
Hey Jude- the first song to go number one over seven minutes.
Revolution- the first song to use extreme distortion?
Revolution- first punk rock song or heavy metal song?
Revolution#9- first song just composed of tape loops.
Happiness Is A Warm Gun- first rock song with Polyryhthm
Savoy Truffle- first rock song using distorted wall of sax sound
The White Album- first double to go number one in Britain
I Want You She So Heavy- first synth hard rock song?
Here Comes the Sun- first synth folk rock song?
Abbey Road side Two- first rock album with long double medleys
Abbey Road- using tape loops or sampling to connect to songs.



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SAL

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #58 on: November 19, 2007, 06:08:32 PM »

The end of the song Hard Days Night uses the Jangle sound that inspired the Byrds. Words of Love the cover version is definitly jangle pop, as What Youre Doing and Ticket to Ride.
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SAL

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Re: Beatles 'Firsts'
« Reply #59 on: November 19, 2007, 06:14:28 PM »

All Music Guide The Byrds

They were inspired by the success of the Beatles to mix folk and rock; McGuinn had already been playing Beatles songs acoustically in Los Angeles folk clubs when Clark approached him to form an act, according to subsequent recollections, in the Peter & Gordon style. David Crosby soon joined to make them a trio, and they made a primitive demo as the Jet Set that was nonetheless bursting with promise. With the help of session musicians, they released a single on Elektra as the Beefeaters that, while a flop, showed them getting quite close to the folk-rock sound that would electrify the pop scene in a few months.

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