DM's Beatles forums
Beatles forums => The Beatles => Topic started by: on May 01, 2004, 10:54:56 PM
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Who plays bass on Old Brown Shoe?
In an interview George says it was him, doing his thing.
On the demo where he does indeed play bass it sounds the same, especially the bridge part that was always outstanding.
One reference I have says Paul doubles George's guitar on bass.
All the rest say it's Paul (or don't indicate at all).
We have many of the same books and reference tools but some of us have better than others. Tho I have most of the usual ones, I'm sure someone (Maria?) here can say with a tad more certainty than what I've indicated above.
After hearing George's demo I personally think it was indeed him. Yes, Paul played the jangly piano on the initial take, but could have overdubbed the bass the second time around.
Any thoughts?
Thanks.
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I haven't a great musical ear at all. However, for what it's worth (ie, not much) the bass never sounded quite like Paul McCartney's work to me.
What Lewisohn says (matching lead and bass guitar notes played by George and Paul) seems reasonable. The sound is very distinctive.
Old Brown Shoe is an interesting song. I've seen it panned and jeered at many times, but for me it's a wonderful gem in the Beatles jewel box. It certainly beats the socks off its mate (Ballad of J & Y).
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Have you heard the demo? I just downlaoded it and I must say the bass figure Paul always gets credit for certainly sounds like what George did.
However, the doubling would certainly explain that, if Paul simply copied George's moves.
Thanks!
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You mean the Feb 25 demo, as on Anthology 3? It seems as if what you say about it is true.
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Is it on A3? Geez. I haven't listened to that in so long I can't believe I didn't even know.
Too much junk piled up in here.
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Walter Everett said "(...) The band, needing a B side for Ballad of John and Yoko, approached the song again on April 16, recording basic track of Harrison's slide part on Telecaster, Ringo's Drums and McCartney's jangle piano; Lennon recorded a rhytym guitar (Casino?) at the same time, but this was later wiped. That day superimpositions include Macca's Jazz Bass doubled in the bridge by Harrison's second Telecasterpart (...)"
This is an extract from The Beatles as musicians: Revolver through the Anthology.
Sissu
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I think it was doubled by P and G, which is the same thing they did with the 'Ob-la-Di' bassline.
Any other Q's on instrumentation, i'm your man. just joined the forum, good to be here.
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[quote by=sissu link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=5 date=1083500246]Walter Everett said "(...) The band, needing a B side for Ballad of John and Yoko, approached the song again on April 16, recording basic track of Harrison's slide part on Telecaster, Ringo's Drums and McCartney's jangle piano; Lennon recorded a rhytym guitar (Casino?) at the same time, but this was later wiped. That day superimpositions include Macca's Jazz Bass doubled in the bridge by Harrison's second Telecasterpart (...)"
This is an extract from The Beatles as musicians: Revolver through the Anthology.
Sissu[/quote]
Thanks. That says it all then. I have read the second book (Revolver-) but I only own the first one. Handy if I have a question up to Rubber Soul, but not much good for anything after! :)
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I have a couple more for the experts.
What is John saying between 'I'm So Tired' and 'Blackbird'? and has it been proved what he said/
Who plays the spanish intro to 'bungalow bill'?
Does anyone know exactly what is available of the woolton village fete performance? I heard 20 seconds of 'putting on the style' with a really heavy drum sound but apparently colin hanton didn't play in the evening, so did they borrow the marching band's drummer.
Thanx in advance
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1.) John is just mumbling. He never said anything about Paul being dead.
2.) It was a pretaped selection on the mellotron (the units were basically tape loops featuring various instruments). It was none of the Beatles,.
3.)Didn't know they had any of it. But then again, on Anthology do they run music behind the pictures? Maybe one of the Fabs had acquired a tape from someone.
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1.) I agree it's just mumbling, but if you play it backwards you can actually make out 'miss him,miss him'.That doesn't convince me that Paul is dead or that Lennon intended it.
2.) Yes, it's a mellotron, but a lot of people have been taken in so don't worry if you were too.
3.) I've heard 'Puttin' on the Style' too but I'm a bit sceptical about where it comes from...
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The bit between 'I'm So Tired' and 'Blackbird' is just John doing an impression of someone who's had too much to drink - it's a classic Britishism. There has been SO much debate over this - just check out the What Goes On website for example! I can't believe so much has been read into it when the answer is so simple!
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[quote by=zipp link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=10 date=1083602072]1.) I agree it's just mumbling, but if you play it backwards you can actually make out 'miss him,miss him'.That doesn't convince me that Paul is dead or that Lennon intended it.
You can make it out because you are listening for what you were told would be there. Turn Me On Deadman is far clearer than the Miss Him bit.
2.) Yes, it's a mellotron, but a lot of people have been taken in so don't worry if you were too.
WTF are you talking about? Taken in with what? It's a mellotron guitar bit loop tape.
3.) I've heard 'Puttin' on the Style' too but I'm a bit sceptical about where it comes from...[/quote]
I don't even know what this sentence means.
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[quote by=The_End link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=11 date=1083604738]The bit between 'I'm So Tired' and 'Blackbird' is just John doing an impression of someone who's had too much to drink - it's a classic Britishism. There has been SO much debate over this - just check out the What Goes On website for example! I can't believe so much has been read into it when the answer is so simple![/quote]
Exactly! It sounds *vaguely* like that because we've been told beforehand what to hear, and the brain clicks to it every time.
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After your help with the previous questions, i have a couple more which have puzzled me for a while.
When was the last Beatles recording session at which all 4 were together. Someone told me it was 'I Want You', Aug 1969??
Also, when was the last time the four beatles breathed the same air? i.e were in the sam eplace together. I know the last photo session was at John's in 1969 but do we know the last time they were together? i have a feeling it might have been an Apple business meeting so impossible to pin down.
Any ideas??
sorry, one more. did John ever play lead on the early records? i know about 'you can't do that' but other possibilities are 'every little thing' and one of the solos on 'long tall sally'???
Thanx in advance
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"When was the last Beatles recording session at which all 4 were together." 20th August 1969, the recording session for I Want You (She's So Heavy)
"Also, when was the last time the four beatles breathed the same air?" As far as I can tell, it was 22nd August 1969 - their last ever photo-shoot at John's newly-acquired residence, Tittenhurst Park. The photo session for the Abbey Road sleeve took place a few weeks earlier on 8th August.
"It might have been an Apple business meeting so impossible to pin down. Any ideas?" Their last business meeting was on 20th September 1969, George was not present - he was visiting his sick Mother in Cheshire. Again, as far as I can tell, THIS was the closest they got to breathing the same air one last time!
"Did John ever play lead on the early records?" I always thought You Can't Do That was the first recorded solo of John's - might be wrong on that!
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thanks for that matey. let's be honest John was a pretty ropey lead player in the early days and 'Slow Down' and 'Every Little THing' solos sound ropey. He played a blinder on 'You Can't DO That' though, didn't he?
One incredibly overlooked classic!
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You're welcome! I must admit, What You're Doing is one of my favourite tracks at the moment; I didn't know it was John taking the lead though - I always thought it was George trying to out-jangle the Byrds on his 12-string Rick.
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What, John played lead on 'What You're Doing'?
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[quote by=guitarhero2000 link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=18 date=1084919754]What, John played lead on 'What You're Doing'?[/quote]
That's what YOU said - I didn't think that he did! ;D
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[quote by=misterchaz link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=12 date=1083609771]
I don't even know what this sentence means.
[/quote]
Sorry I didn't answer this m.c. but I've only just seen it and you mixed up the quote with your reactions which is a bit confusing!
Here are my answers.
1.I've never heard 'Turn me on deadman' on any song, backward or forward.Tell me exactly where it is.I do hear 'Miss him,miss him' and not just because I was told to.Do you think I just repeat other people's fantasies?
2.WTF to you too.A lot of people don't know the beginning to Bungalow Bill is a mellotron.You obviously do but that's no reason to react as if they did.
3.Sceptical means you're doubtful about something.I have doubts that 'Puttin' on the style' really was recorded at the time and may be a fake.
8)
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Zipp, "Turn me on deadman" is supposedly heard when you play Revolution #9 backwards. It does actually sound like that.
Another one to check out is the end of Sgt. Peppers when the loop of "Couldnt really be any other way" (I think thats what it says, but I havent listened to it recently) plays. If its played backwards, it sounds like they're saying - "We'll Fu** You Like Superman".
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[quote by=tkitna link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=21 date=1084958976]Zipp, "Turn me on deadman" is supposedly heard when you play Revolution #9 backwards. It does actually sound like that.
Another one to check out is the end of Sgt. Peppers when the loop of "Couldnt really be any other way" (I think thats what it says, but I havent listened to it recently) plays. If its played backwards, it sounds like they're saying - "We'll Fu** You Like Superman".[/quote]
Thanks tkitna.
Can you be more precise, since I'm certainly not going to listen to the whole of Rev 9 backwards!
As for Sgt.Pepper, I hear 'There never could be any other' and backwards I don't hear anything much at all. :-/
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Legend has it that when you play Revolution #9 backwards you hear "turn me on dead, man" - I was never sure which part of the song to play backwards though! The "number nine" bit sounds nothing like it (sounds like "neerimenon" to me!). The only bit I THINK it could be is the crowd chanting at the end. But the 'Faul' supporters claim it's "Paul is dead" that's actually shouted!
It's pretty much impossible to determine which way the Pepper run-out groove should be played - "Couldnt really be any other way" is a pretty good translation though. I've tried playing it backwards, and it sounds nothing like "well f**k you like supermen"... you can just make out the "supermen" bit - if you allow a lot of poetic license!
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[quote by=The_End link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=23 date=1084970177]Legend has it that when you play Revolution #9 backwards you hear "turn me on dead, man" - I was never sure which part of the song to play backwards though! The "number nine" bit sounds nothing like it (sounds like "neerimenon" to me!). The only bit I THINK it could be is the crowd chanting at the end. But the 'Faul' supporters claim it's "Paul is dead" that's actually shouted!
It's pretty much impossible to determine which way the Pepper run-out groove should be played - "Couldnt really be any other way" is a pretty good translation though. I've tried playing it backwards, and it sounds nothing like "well f**k you like supermen"... you can just make out the "supermen" bit - if you allow a lot of poetic license![/quote]
So I'm not the only one who can't hear this stuff. :)
As for the Rev 9 crowd, they're not shouting backwards.They're saying "Hold that line" and "Block that kick".
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[quote by=zipp link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=20 date=1084956554]
Sorry I didn't answer this m.c. but I've only just seen it and you mixed up the quote with your reactions which is a bit confusing!
Here are my answers.
1.I've never heard 'Turn me on deadman' on any song, backward or forward.Tell me exactly where it is.
***The 'number nine' bit at the beginning.
I do hear 'Miss him,miss him' and not just because I was told to.Do you think I just repeat other people's fantasies?
***No, what I'm saying is since it was so widely disseminated that this was there that subliminally you hear it. It DOES sound like it, but my main point was that he does NOT actually say the words 'Paul is dead, man, miss him'. It's another backward masking effect.
2.WTF to you too.A lot of people don't know the beginning to Bungalow Bill is a mellotron.You obviously do but that's no reason to react as if they did.
***I don't know what you're referring to, I'll have to go back to my post, as it's not quoted here. But I myself only recently learned it was a mellotron so I certainly have no place lording the knowledge over anyone else, and I don't believe I was.
3.Sceptical means you're doubtful about something.I have doubts that 'Puttin' on the style' really was recorded at the time and may be a fake.
8)
***I have no take on this as I never heard OF the song or the song itself.
[/quote]
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Ah.
I went back to my old post and I see I misread each and every one of your replies, and in fact you were not really replying to me at all but to the OP. My sincere apologies.
Apparently I seem to think the world revolves around ME. :)
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[quote by=tkitna link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=21 date=1084958976]Zipp, "Turn me on deadman" is supposedly heard when you play Revolution #9 backwards. It does actually sound like that.
Another one to check out is the end of Sgt. Peppers when the loop of "Couldnt really be any other way" (I think thats what it says, but I havent listened to it recently) plays. If its played backwards, it sounds like they're saying - "We'll Fu** You Like Superman".[/quote]
It sounds like 'this is the ending of the wax' but in fact was simply scraps put together. A lot of things sound like something else when played backwards. The whole 70's and 80's US congressional hearings into backwards masking had to be the stupidest misuse of government time ever. Or maybe not...there's a lot of precedent stupidity before hand I suppose...
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[quote by=The_End link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=19 date=1084919849]
That's what YOU said - I didn't think that he did! ;D[/quote]
No i said 'Every Little Thing' and 'Long Tall Sally' and/or 'SLow Down'
re: backwards stuff. being a language teacher, i can tell you that the phonetic (i.e sounds) alphabet is not that big so most sounds can be vaguely interpreted as something else.
n.b 'Cranberry sauce' sounds like 'Gran buried Paul' not 'i buried Paul'. check it out
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LOL! This is all getting very confusing! ;D
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hmm i think you're right
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Right about what? Just kidding ;)
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[quote by=misterchaz link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=26 date=1084983510]Ah.
I went back to my old post and I see I misread each and every one of your replies, and in fact you were not really replying to me at all but to the OP.
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[quote by=zipp link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=32 date=1084996185]'Puttin' on the style' is a snippet from a bootleg and is supposed to be from the fateful day when Paul met John.Do you think that day could possibly have been recorded?[/quote]
A recording of that very day does exist. It went up for auction a few years back - the bootleg snippit is what Sotherbys used to promote the item.
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That's right.it was recorded by a fellow called Geoff Molineux (prob. spelt wrong) and it went for 200k i think. there was 'puttin' on the style' and 'baby let's play house'. 'puttin' on the style' is available on Anthology more 1. it sounds like it could be John Lennon but i'm puzzled by the fact that the recording is very drum-heavy but apparently Colin Hanton (quarrymen's drummer) went home and didn't play that gig!!?? did they borrow a drummer from the George Edwards band who headlined that night?
On that subject, has anyone read 'The Day John Met Paul' by Jim O'Donnell?? it's a dramatized version of 6/7/57. very evocative, a bloody good read. he collected actual news from that day and pounded the pavements of liverpool as part of 2 years research, to get the atmosphere and history of the place.
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Thanks for the info.
Did the Beatles attract people with tape recorders?
In the fifties these things were pretty rare...
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i know what you mean. there always seems to be someone who recorded them, thought nothing of it and found it in his loft 20 years later.
it is incredible to think, if it's true, that Molineaux recorded the whole night and wiped most of it, he was wiping about half a million's worth but of course on the day he was taping a group of lads from nowheresville at a village fete. Amazing!!
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[quote by=tkitna link=Blah.pl?b=cc,m=1083452096,s=21 date=1084958976]Zipp, "Turn me on deadman" is supposedly heard when you play Revolution #9 backwards. It does actually sound like that.
Another one to check out is the end of Sgt. Peppers when the loop of "Couldnt really be any other way" (I think thats what it says, but I havent listened to it recently) plays. If its played backwards, it sounds like they're saying - "We'll Fu** You Like Superman".[/quote]
o_______O The "turn me on, deadman..." sounds exactly like that to me, but the inner groove on Sgt. Pepper's sounds...hardly like "We'll fsck you like Superman..." more "*mumble* good fsck..." to me, can't remember. XD