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Solo forums => John Lennon => Topic started by: Heather_Michele on August 20, 2004, 03:51:33 AM

Title: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Heather_Michele on August 20, 2004, 03:51:33 AM
I like documentaries, when they are about the Beatles, but I saw one the other day that made me so angry and sad and dissapointed in human beings.  It was about John's life after the Beatles, and the life of Mark Chapman (I hate typing his name, makes me feel like he won)  and when it got to December 8, 1980, I learned somethign I didn't know.  Chapman got his autograph that day.  I was so disgusted, I called my boyfriend to rant and he told me he already knew about that.  I couldn't believe it.  The worse part of the documentary was that they tried to justify Chapman's actions kinda, because he was "mentaly ill".  He was a self centered little bastard who didn't want to die a nobody.  Please tell me that there aren't anymore little depressing facts like that about it.   :'(
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: on August 20, 2004, 03:54:48 AM
Nope. 

Other than the fact Yoko had her husband assassinated right in front of her.  And Sean only being 5 and all.  And a whole generation losing its youth in one moment of madness.

That about covers it.


(Not trying to be a smart-ass...I guess the biggest event of all was his needless and violent death.  Everything else was branched out from that.  I applaud your insight about MDC tho...he really was just a little sh*t.  Crazy?  Who can say?  But his actions were beyond craziness.)
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Heather_Michele on August 20, 2004, 03:57:43 AM
I knew Sean was 5, but I thought the whole assassination bit was a rumor?  Anyone want to verify it as truth, I never believed it. Hmmm.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Heather_Michele on August 20, 2004, 03:58:03 AM
I mean that Yoko planned it
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: on August 20, 2004, 06:16:57 AM
No, I don't mean Yoko had anything to do with it. 

MDC pumped 5 bullets at close range into John from a dropknee stance, for absolutely no reason except his own bizarre thoughts.  The fact that John was not just *shot*, he was totally blown away is what I referred to.

And it IS beyond sad.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: visitorfromarticcircle on August 20, 2004, 09:28:07 AM
i post this link  once before, but anyway - heres a lot of stuff about it

http://www.mackwhite.com/lennon.html
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Sadie4 on August 20, 2004, 04:57:15 PM
 There's lots of things to say about that dredful act, but I'd better shut up, I don't want to give that loony any nmore publicity.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: number14 on August 20, 2004, 06:25:04 PM
Is Mark Chapman dead?
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: on August 20, 2004, 07:37:53 PM
[quote by=number14 link=Blah.pl?b=lennon,m=1092973893,s=7 date=1093026304]Is Mark Chapman dead?[/quote]

No, but he will be minutes after walking out the the jail loony bin.

Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Soft_Guitar60 on August 20, 2004, 08:06:33 PM
So, what did happen with Chapman after the whole thing?
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Heather_Michele on August 21, 2004, 04:27:02 AM
if I remember right from teh documentary he is in jail, he was up for parole in october of 2000 but they didn't let him go.  I agree with Sadie4, I don't like talking about it.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Soft_Guitar60 on August 21, 2004, 11:55:19 AM
It's making us sad...

In Belgium (where I live) they will be showing a sort of documentary where he was that day and when he was...(you know what I mean...I don't want to talk about it).
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Sadie4 on August 21, 2004, 05:27:17 PM
 So, we'd better not talk more about that a**hole
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Indica on August 21, 2004, 06:25:14 PM
I think they dont want Chapman released, because of obvious reasons.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Soft_Guitar60 on August 22, 2004, 07:52:47 PM
When will he be released? I'll cripple him...
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: HFleen on August 22, 2004, 08:28:03 PM
I think that there WILL be some action taken against this criminal -- I do not support this -- but I think it WILL happen....big time!

Herb
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: on August 23, 2004, 01:37:49 AM
Will you people please shut up.

What happened to John was a tragedy but whats happened has happened and you can't change it.

Saying that you'll cripple or kill Mark Chapman if he gets out (which I doubt highly that he will) is incredible to me, I'm sure John would never have wanted that, a life for a life dosen't work.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: on August 23, 2004, 05:55:03 AM
[quote by=Heather_Michele link=Blah.pl?b=lennon,m=1092973893,s=0 date=1092973893]I like documentaries, when they are about the Beatles, but I saw one the other day that made me so angry and sad and dissapointed in human beings.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Taxgirl on August 30, 2004, 10:26:29 AM
[quote by=colleen link=Blah.pl?b=lennon,m=1092973893,s=17 date=1093240503]

There's even a picture out there of John signing the autograph for MDC.

[/quote]

Yes, I saw that picture.

I just wonder, if MDC was offially pronounced mentally ill, even before what he did, why wasn't he in the hospital, and how could he have a gun.
What if he killed John by proxy? What if the government entrusted him, because John was dangerous for them? Just remember how John stood by peace, and his ideology moved many people.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: tkitna on August 30, 2004, 12:42:41 PM
Supposedly, Chapman has found God and all that stuff, while in prison, which will aid him in his quest for parole and such,,,,,,,,,,,,,BUT, if he does get out, there can only be two bad sides to it. The first is that a murdering bastard, lowlife fuk like him will actually succeed in seeing freedom one more time. The second is that some crazy John fan could actually repeat the deed towards Chapman, in which alot of negative karma heads towards the Lennon camp. Its a no win situation.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: on August 30, 2004, 07:53:29 PM
Most Lennon fans don't endorse someone *really* capping him (tho it is not bad to think about once a year around Dec eighth).

But most fans know that SOMEone will.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Joost on August 30, 2004, 07:57:15 PM
[quote by=Heather_Michele link=Blah.pl?b=lennon,m=1092973893,s=0 date=1092973893]The worse part of the documentary was that they tried to justify Chapman's actions kinda, because he was "mentaly ill".
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Indica on August 30, 2004, 09:04:12 PM
Finding god...
A true sign of how religion is merely a tool for the shallow-forced like nature of Human-self pity.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: on August 31, 2004, 03:23:12 AM
[quote by=Biscuit_Power link=Blah.pl?b=lennon,m=1092973893,s=21 date=1093895835]

That's not an excuse, but the only logical explanation if you ask me...
[/quote]

Exactly.  A sane person does not think of doing what he did.

But there's a real fine line.  We all tend to know when we're screwing up.  At some point someone has to let it in, go with it instead of fight it and/or seek help.

That's where the crime starts.

Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Sondra on August 31, 2004, 05:25:29 AM
I don't know. What we think of as sane my not be so. There are some people that just have absolutly NO concience whatsoever and so they do not feel compassion, guilt, and so on. Yet they can mimic it perfectly an do so because they know that this is the norm. So does this mean that they are insane? They know enough about appropriate behavior in order to be able to display it when needed, yet they choose not to follow the rules of society anyway because they think they are above it. I don't know. It's a fine line between insanity and willfull defiance.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: SieLiebtDich on August 31, 2004, 06:40:42 AM
I don't wish the guy (MC) the best or the worst.......I don't recommment him to get out of jail though........if you know what i mean.............
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Beatle Ed on August 31, 2004, 07:24:47 AM
1. Chapmin WAS/IS Mentally ill, he is a paranoid schizophrenic. Not that this is an excuse. But to say he wasn't mentally ill is wrong.

2. His parole hearing was denied[2 times]

Quote
The parole board was headed by R. Guy Vizzie. The other members were W. William Smith Jr. and Daniel J. Doyle.

Parole is denied. You murdered the victim, John Lennon, when you fired a .38 special caliber Charter Arm revolver, filled with hollow-point bullets. You discharged all five chambers and hit Mr. Lennon as many as four times. Mr. Lennon was returning to his residence and was in the company of his wife when you committed this murder. This act was calculated and unprovoked. You had planned this crime for a protracted period of time and it is apparent that you were obsessed in causing fatal harm to John Lennon. In addition to being an international celebrity, Mr. Lennon was a husband and a father of two young children.

During your incarceration, you have maintained an exemplary disciplinary record which this panel has noted and considered. This panel also recognizes that, because of your continued special housing status, you have been unable to avail yourself of anti-violence and/or anti-aggression programming.

Your most vicious and violent act was apparently fueled by your need to be acknowledged. During your parole hearing, this panel noted your continued interest in maintaining your notoriety.

When all factors are reviewed, your discretionary release is determined to be inappropriate. Additionally, this panel strongly believes that your release to parole supervision at this time would deprecate the seriousness of the crime and serve to undermine respect for the law.


3. His next parole hearing is October of this year.

4. Yes JOhn signed an autograph for him. And apparently, someone got a pic of them together too. (http://www.johnmonty.com/cotw/chapman.jpg)


which leads me to the title of a new song. Imagine there's no parole
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Beatle Ed on August 31, 2004, 07:28:49 AM
[quote by=Taxgirl link=Blah.pl?b=lennon,m=1092973893,s=18 date=1093861589]I just wonder, if MDC was offially pronounced mentally ill, even before what he did, why wasn't he in the hospital, and how could he have a gun. [/quote]


Because not all schizophrenics kill. Most of them do not belong in mental hospitals, my best friend is schizophrenic and he takes alot of medicine and always will, he's not going to go kill someone, Mark had a little extra sh!t in him if you ask me.  and it was 1980, gun laws were nil back then
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: SieLiebtDich on August 31, 2004, 07:40:59 AM
I wonder if this would appear on the news???about (MC)
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Sondra on August 31, 2004, 07:44:17 AM
Exactly. This man was functioning enough to know that he needed help but he chose not to get it. He would rather live out his delusional fantasies. Calling someone schizophrenic certainly does not mean they have no power over the choices they make and there's a lot of help out there for them if they choose to take it. He was smart enought to get on a plane, find out where John lived, get his autograph, and they lay in wait. I've worked w/ people who have some degree of mental illness, schizophrenics, psychotics, etc. and they cannot funtion half as well as this guy did. Uh, yet they have never thought to muder someone. 'This guy had WAY more going on. Like his need to be noticed as the patrol board said. Anyway, he knew he was in trouble mentally, he even said it. And then he chose not to do anything about it. So he was at fault plain and simple. Not everyone that's a cold blooded murderer can blame it on mental illness. That's an insult to the peple that actually have those issues.
Title: Re: so sad that I didn't know
Post by: Beatle Ed on September 02, 2004, 12:11:00 AM
I don't think its to be used to make MDC look better. But normal people do not kill others.