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Author Topic: Beatles Innovations  (Read 6053 times)

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Ydoll Gwyn

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #20 on: July 29, 2005, 11:49:00 PM »

Quote from: pc31
sgt pepper was the first rock gatefold i think and first concept album...
but how firsts for ringo?first to elevate the drummer.first bass drum in liverpool...there are others too someone must know...

Beatles For Sale was a gatefold. Gatefolds were very common, but not for "pop" music. Pepper (of course) was not really a concept album ...

But you are right about the elevation of the drummer. Ringo is regularly put down by ignorant people, but gee he did a lot for the status of the drummer as a musician.
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adamzero

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #21 on: July 30, 2005, 02:57:10 AM »

I agree: Ringo put the beat in Beatles. The way his drums were recorded and mixed--out front and big--had a lot to do with the Beatles innovative sound.  Sun Records recorded big drums--check out Jerry Lee Lewis "Great Balls of Fire," but the sound was muddy compared to the crispness of the Beatles recordings.  You can really hear the kick and snare--not to mention all those cymbals.

Double-tracking: the Beatles were one of the first groups to double-track lead vocals.  They originally had to do this live, but Geoff Emerick and the techs came up with flanging or phasing as a way to produce the sound of two voices singing almost in sync.  It's sorta like echo, but echo is the multiplied repeat of a sound that decays.  Flanging fattens up the voice.  This helped the great lead vocals of Paul and John (more often) stand out in front of those big drums.  

Horns: the Beatles close-miked horns (on songs like Got to Get You Into My Life) in way that hadn't been done before.  They stuck the mikes practically into the horns, giving them the tonal clarity and attack you wouldn't get if you just miked the room.  

Sitar and other Indian musical instruments: Beatles were the first to incorporate these into pop-rock music.

I don't know if they were the first to do this, but the Beatles did gender-bending versions of girl-group songs like Please Mister Postman.  

The Beatles were one of the first groups to popularize the mellotron (e.g., Strawberry Field Forever opening).  

I think the ultimate innovation of the Beatles was having four irreplaceable parts in a pop group where the whole was greater than the sum of the parts.   From the very beginning this was recognized and they were marketed that way.   Each member was in his way so distinctive that you couldn't replace one and still have the Beatles.


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An Apple Beatle

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #22 on: July 30, 2005, 03:16:24 AM »

Quote from: adamzero
I agree: Ringo put the beat in Beatles. The way his drums were recorded and mixed--out front and big--had a lot to do with the Beatles innovative sound.
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adamzero

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #23 on: July 30, 2005, 02:28:15 PM »

Swotting--great word!

I haven't read Revolution in Your Head.  Most of my info comes Heartsgaard, Lewisohn and years of idleness.
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An Apple Beatle

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #24 on: July 30, 2005, 02:53:53 PM »

Nice stuff. ;)
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number14

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2005, 07:42:20 PM »

they made rock n roll real
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Ydoll Gwyn

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #26 on: July 30, 2005, 09:13:03 PM »

Quote from: pc31
thats not here tho dolly........

"Here" means nothing on the internet. YOU live in the US. So what? Try and judge things from a perspective that's a little wider than your own backyard.

Moreover, it doesn't change the fact that Beatles For Sale had a gatefold before Pepper. BFS wasn't released as such in the 60s in the US; however, elsewhere in the world it was - and it had a gatefold sleeve.
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Ydoll Gwyn

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #27 on: July 30, 2005, 09:14:39 PM »

Quote from: number14
they made rock n roll real

Meaningless. Rock n roll was real enough coming from the likes of Little Richard, Chuck Berry, Jerry Lee Lewis, and a host of others. Did not even the Beatles themselves admire them?
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Brynjar

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #28 on: July 30, 2005, 10:53:33 PM »

Nice thread.

Here is a great article from answers.com:

http://www.answers.com/topic/the-beatles-influence

I like the fact that George Martin offered them a "guaranteed" number 1 single with
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mclen57

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #29 on: July 31, 2005, 03:35:24 AM »

Quote from: adamzero
I agree: Ringo put the beat in Beatles. The way his drums were recorded and mixed--out front and big--had a lot to do with the Beatles innovative sound.
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Henry the Horse

pc31

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #30 on: July 31, 2005, 04:31:52 AM »

ask tony b

raxo

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #31 on: April 30, 2006, 04:05:42 AM »

Quote from: Bobber
...
- in order to give their fans value for their money, they hardly put any singles on their albums. Well, in the USA it happened, much to the disagreement of the Beatles themselves.
...

Nice summary there!!! ... (thumbsup)

... but I wouldn't say "they hardly put any singles on their albums" ... it was not a very Guyish thing to do tho some people may think so ... another myth (things were not so strict):  ::)

They released many (more or less half of them!!! ... and some of the most famo-us) singles on their albums, every year!!!:

1963.- Love Me Do and Please Please Me
1964.- Can't Buy Me Love and A Hard Day's Night
1965.- Help! and Ticket To Ride (A-sides)
1966.- Yellow Submarine
1967.- All You Need Is Love (A-side) and I Am The Walrus (B-side)
1968.- the re-make of Revolution 1
1969.- Come Together/Something
1970.- Get Back and Let It Be (A-side) ...
-----------------------------------------------
20 songs = 10 singles  :o


... imagine! they even included Yellow Submarine (once again on an album after have been a single too) and All You Need Is Love on their Yellow Submarine album!!! ...  ::)

... and I'm not going to remember A Collection Of Oldies But Goldies (1966) including recent singles too ... or those tons of EPs till mid-60s with nothing new on them (exception: Long Tall Sally EP including their original I Call Your Name) ...  ::)

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The End

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #32 on: May 02, 2006, 12:18:55 PM »

I do not agree - I think it IS true to say that they hardly ever took singles from their albums. Some of the tracks you mentioned were actually released BEFORE the albums (Ticket To Ride and Can't Buy Me Love for example) but still it was still quite rare for a song to be released as a single and to also appear on an LP.

For example - none of the following albums contained ANY UK singles:

With The Beatles
Beatles For Sale
Rubber Soul
Sgt Pepper
White Album (you can't say that Revolution was released from this album - it was a TOTALLY different version!)

PLUS they released all of these singles which didn't appear on a any UK albums (apart from A Collection Of Oldies)!!!!

Love Me Do - version 1 with Ringo on drums (different version to the Please Please Me LP)
From Me To You - Thank You Girl
She Love's You - I'll Get You
I Want To Hold Your Hand - This Boy
I Feel Fine - She's A Woman
Help! (different vocal to Help! stereo LP version) - I'm Down
Day Tripper - We Can Work It Out
Paperback Writer - Rain
Strawberry Fields Forever - Penny Lane
(All You Need Is Love appeared on Yellow Submarine) - Baby You're A Rich Man
Hello, Goodbye  - I Am The Walrus
Lady Madonna  - The Inner Light
Hey Jude - Revolution (version 2 - completely different to White Album version)
Get Back (different ending to Let It Be version) - Don't Let Me Down
Ballad Of John And Yoko - Old Brown Shoe
Let It Be (different verses and guitar solos to Let It Be version) - You Know My Name

PLUS they released 2 EPs of exclusive material - Long Tall Sally and Magical Mystery Tour and had one spare track left over for their greatest hits collection in 1966 (A Collection of Oldies) - Bad Boy

To me that looks like quite an obvious policy of trying not to release singles from albums, don't you?
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raxo

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #33 on: May 02, 2006, 12:31:37 PM »

Ok, from that point of view you're right ... I was only seeing the half of the thing ... :B  again!!!LOL!  :D
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raxo

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #34 on: May 02, 2006, 12:53:44 PM »

 :-/ Well, I've re-read the "original post" and mine too ... and I insist:
I wouldn't say they hardly put any singles on their albums

Quote from: raxo
...

... but I wouldn't say "they hardly put any singles on their albums" ... it was not a very Guyish thing to do tho some people may think so ... another myth (things were not so strict):  ::)
...

... tho your data are really appreciated, The End.  :)
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mclen57

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Re: Beatles Innovations
« Reply #35 on: May 04, 2006, 03:12:05 AM »

Getting a little off the current track here, but wasn't Yesterday and Today (with British Revolver tracks I'm Only Sleeping, And Your Bird Can Sing and Dr Robert) released 2 mos. before Revolver was released? So us Yanks got a sneak preview of the Revolver sessions even BEFORE the Brits? If so, that's sort of a US milestone here.
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Henry the Horse
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