DM's Beatles forums

Solo forums => Fifth Beatles and the Merseybeat Scene => Topic started by: An Apple Beatle on September 12, 2005, 02:42:51 PM

Title: Brian Epstein
Post by: An Apple Beatle on September 12, 2005, 02:42:51 PM
Just thought he should have his thread in 5th Beatles.

At The Beatles exhibition in Liverpool they show the letter Brian wrote just before his death. It was like a resignation letter. Very sad to read as it goes.

Heres a pic I got of it.


(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v246/Stanzamuso/Epstein-Letter.jpg)
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Paulsluv on September 12, 2005, 05:13:03 PM
Cool! I vaguely remember something like that 9 years ago unless they recently put in the exhibit.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on August 30, 2006, 08:51:05 AM
An article from The Guardian of August 28th, 1967

The Beatles' Diaghilev dies at 32

Stanley Reynolds
Monday August 28, 1967
The Guardian

Mr Brian Epstein, who built up the Beatles, Cilla Black, and others to international fame, was found dead in bed in his home in Belgravia, London, yesterday. He was 32.

Police were called by the housekeeper. A friend of Mr Epstein said: "He has been unwell for some months."

The Beatles were in Bangor where they were initiated into the cult of the Himalayan mystic, Maharishi Mahesh Yogi. Paul McCartney and his friend Jane Asher, the actress, left for London after hearing the news. Mr McCartney, looking pale and distressed, said: "It is a great shock and I am upset."

John Lennon said: "The Maharishi told us not to be too overwhelmed by grief. I have lost only a few people who were very close to me. This is one of those occasions, but I feel my course of meditation here has helped me overcome my grief more easily than before."

Brian Epstein was considered as the Svengali who, by magic, created the Beatles and the resulting beat music boom. But he always denied [this] and their long-running success has proved him right. He was far more the Diaghilev of pop music than a Svengali.

Indeed, his personal tastes were for the exotic, artistic, and classical. He loved classical music and enjoyed talking about it, which he could do in some depth. He was shy and sensitive.

The sensitive side of his nature was, perhaps, the source of his melancholy. At times he seemed like a character enmeshed in an elaborate ironic Nabokovian plot: the modern artist-business man beset by the thoroughly old-fashioned vulgarities of the Philistine.

Born in 1935, Epstein had a conventional middle-class Jewish background. At 16 he started in his father's furniture shop, and broke this off for a time to study at the Royal Academy of Dramatic Art, but became very successful in it as the manager of the family business record department.

In October, 1961. Customers, he said, kept asking for a record called "Mr Bonnie," which the Beatles had recorded in Germany for an obscure company. The Beatles were appearing at the Cavern Club, just round the corner from his shop. The rest of this story is well known.

Less well known or appreciated are Epstein's attempts to broaden his own scope as an impresario. In 1965 he bought the Saville Theatre. Unfortunately, he lost money with many of his productions there, particularly James Baldwin's play "The Amen Corner."

All this added to his melancholy; he suffered from poor health, and the death of his father, with whom he was extremely close, was another blow.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Kaleidoscope_Eyes on March 13, 2007, 03:33:21 AM
I have a question about Brian. In Shout! i read that his "ex-lover broke the $3000 silence bond". But that will mean that everyone will know that the exlover was also homosexual and that was still illegal in Britain. So why would he do that? Just for the money? Also, what happened to someone who was homosexual then?
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Kevin on March 13, 2007, 09:26:02 AM
Quote from: 596
Also, what happened to someone who was homosexual then?

They burned in hell.
No really - I'll think you'll find that being homosexual wasn't illegal, but comitting a homosexual act (sodomy, listening to Barbara Streisand) was.
It's like drug laws now - Pete Doherty can't be busted for saying he takes drugs, police need to catch him in the act.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Indica on March 13, 2007, 11:34:56 PM
Pete Doherty should be arrested for being Pete Doherty.

A new 'Doherty Court Act' should be created.

All in favour - "Hear, hear!" ...
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Indica on March 13, 2007, 11:37:14 PM
Cheers for the Photo App - Can anyone find a blow up version of the resignation letter(?)

On another note - how impressive is the level of journalism in regards to the Guardian article!
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Revolution on March 14, 2007, 04:30:53 AM
Pete Doherty is a Freak!!!!!!!!!!!!! :P    Back to topic, for once. ;D Brian, whatever he was, was Smart enough to listen to the kids about the Beatles and ask for that record. 8)
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Kaleidoscope_Eyes on March 15, 2007, 09:31:12 PM
Quote from: 593
;D Brian, whatever he was, was Smart enough to listen to the kids about the Beatles and ask for that record. 8)

I agree, if it wasn't for him... I love the man!
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Andy Smith on March 17, 2007, 03:34:01 PM
Thank god Brian was at the cavern that day!!
Brian saw something in the fabs & gave them a chance!
(like the rutles - they had something,  "i think it was the trousers!")
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: on March 20, 2007, 04:19:17 PM
Pete Doherty and Kate Moss are being turned into media martyrs. Why do the papers pick on them when everyone knows that showbusiness is run on celebrity sherbert? They're just scapegoats, loads of other high profile people do all sorts of things, the police know about it, they just don't do a thing about it unless the papes want to pick on them. Then they have to investigate due to public outcry. They have to be seen to be doing the 'right' thing.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on April 12, 2007, 10:47:35 AM
I have mixed feelings towards Brian. He made The Beatles big, but maybe he also ruined them. He put them into suits because that would sell better towards the record companies and all that. Also he reduced their show to an almost meaningless half an hour. Just thirty minutes. I'm still amazed that people were happy with that, but maybe I should compare it to modern concerts. Brian turned their concerts into a routine instead of an inspiration. God knows what more could have come out of their talents if it had had the change to go wherever they wanted to go.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Kevin on April 12, 2007, 11:34:39 AM
It's a strange situation. It many respects they seem like Elvis in that they handed their soles over to their manager. Yet they had the power to say "no more" in 1966. Why didn't they speak up earlier? Should Brian have seen it coming and done something about it? But maybe it's all just hindsight - the world was different then and Brian and the band were learning as they went along. There was no precedent for what they were doing.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: raxo on April 12, 2007, 12:44:02 PM
Quote from: 63
[...] Also he reduced their show to an almost meaningless half an hour. Just thirty minutes. I'm still amazed that people were happy with that, but maybe I should compare it to modern concerts. Brian turned their concerts into a routine instead of an inspiration. [...]
My thoughts too  :-/ ... those people were happy with almost nothing but seeing them for a while  ::) ... but I want to believe that that was done by Brian because of their sketchdule: radio, recording sessions and later they were touring through US and Europe and even went to Australia and Japan and somewhere else and starred in films ... by the way, how long their shows at The Cavern used to be by 1962? ??) ...

As Kevin said: "There was no precedent for what they were doing"

Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on April 12, 2007, 12:54:55 PM
Quote from: 297
by the way, how long their shows at The Cavern used to be by 1962? ??) ...
I think that was more than half an hour, even tho Mr Epstein was in charge then. The Star Club in December 1962 was probably one of the last venues to see them for a real full concert. Maybe early 1963 in some local places round Liverpool.


Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: raxo on April 12, 2007, 01:13:40 PM
Quote from: 63
I think that was more than half an hour, even tho Mr Epstein was in charge then. The Star Club in December 1962 was probably one of the last venues to see them for a real full concert. Maybe early 1963 in some local places round Liverpool.
I'm sure that it was more than half an hour ... I think it could be about an hour or ... then a break? ??) ... and finalley another show of about an hour ... I've got no clue but that was always what I'd imagined ...

About The Star Club, I think it was more or less the same: an hour or some more, a break (for a striptease number or something else ;D) and more after that ... maybe those famous 8 hours were counting the moment the began the evening till the moment the played their last song in the night or in the early morning!LOL) breaks included ... just a theory  :-/ ...

Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: harihead on April 12, 2007, 02:39:29 PM
Quote
John Lennon said: "The Maharishi told us not to be too overwhelmed by grief. I have lost only a few people who were very close to me."
Ugh, that got me in the heart. "Only a few people"-- yeah, like his mom. Talk about putting a positive spin on it...

Back on topic. I don't know the length of the Star Club shows specifically, but most of the earlier Hamburg shows described the band as doing 45 minutes on, then a 15-minute break. Of course, the band was badgered to keep playing and shorten their break!

About Brian's shows being so short, from what I read, it was what "professional" groups did on their tours. A tour meant several acts going around the country, and each group did 10 or 15 minutes depending on their status, until the headliner who did--whoa! 30 whole minutes! Or even 35! Bonanza!

So Brian just took that formula to make the Beatles look like all the other professional groups. They still did long shows for ballrooms etc. that they had previously booked, but this was considered a step down from playing theatres. It was the convention of the time, strange and disappointing as it now seems to us. We want our favorite artists to play for 2 hours at least! How cool that could have been. I bet all the girls would have stopped screaming, if only from exhaustion, during a long show, and then they could have heard some banter as well. What a loss for everyone!
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: raxo on April 12, 2007, 03:06:02 PM
The mistake was to think that they were not important enough on their own to make a big show by themselves with maybe another two or three acts ... so they would be able to play for an hour or so too as they surely did in The cavern or The Star Club or ballrooms ...

... did they think that poeple woldn't have paid to see them and that they needed more acts or it was because of how much that tours would have costed? ??)
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Kevin on April 12, 2007, 03:21:01 PM
I think the promoters (and Brian) wre just trying to make as much money as possible with the minimum effort. If kids were prepared to part with their cash for a twenty minute show then that was good business. Quality just wasn't an issue.
I would have hoped that The Beatles themselves would have pushed for a better arrangement, but it doesn't seem to have bothered them. They seem to have been caught up in the circus like everyone else. the whole Beatlemania thing seems to have a momentum that no one was prepared (or able) to change. But their defense was that no one was listening anyway.
Sad that such a great live act should have been reduced to what seems a shameless self-parody (not their fault though.)
Beatlemania was a beast.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Andy Smith on April 12, 2007, 09:19:33 PM
8 HOUR SHOWS IN HAMBURG down to 30-mins shoes by 66. Crazy!!!!
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: pc31 on April 13, 2007, 03:44:38 AM
what about his king features fiasco???face it the man was only in it for the money...
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: pc31 on April 13, 2007, 03:46:18 AM
beatles dates has times and venues...its a red book...
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Kevin on April 13, 2007, 09:37:03 AM
Quote from: 614
8 HOUR SHOWS IN HAMBURG down to 30-mins shoes by 66. Crazy!!!!

I think Haiheads comments are bang on. The Stones were doing only 30 minute sets in 66 also.
I wonder who broke the mould?
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: harihead on April 13, 2007, 02:18:06 PM
Help for Bobber counting hours:

According to the new Elizabeth Partridge book about John Lennon, the Beatles played "over 500 hours" after their first trip to Hamburg.  Also according to her, the Beatles were initially hired to play 4 hours during the week and 6 hours during the weekends.  However, I have a feeling that the Hamburg sessions in particular could go much longer, depending on who was wanting them to play.  So this is a pretty loose estimate to start with.

I think what we really need is a time machine so we can go back and check. *begins construction*

Quote from: Kevin
The Stones were doing only 30 minute sets in 66 also.
I wonder who broke the mould?
Good info on the Stones. I'd like to learn the answer to this question, too. :)
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: raxo on April 13, 2007, 02:38:22 PM
Quote from: 551
[...]
I think what we really need is a time machine so we can go back and check. *begins construction*
"Is there , even now, a machine to count such numbers?" Derek Taylor 8)

P.S. I hope Bobber had it!  ;D
Quote from: 551
[...]
Good info on the Stones. I'd like to learn the answer to this question, too. :)
Some of these: Jimi Hendrix, Cream, Led Zeppelin? ... I've got no clue but it had to be by late 60s ...
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Kevin on April 13, 2007, 02:44:56 PM
Quote from: 551

Good info on the Stones. I'd like to learn the answer to this question, too. :)

I tried to find sets for The Who on google but can't. I imagine Dylan was doing longer - but he comes from a folk background so it's probably not a fair comparison.
The underground bands like Floyd and The Grateful dead were doing monster sessions, but they weren't tours as such so again no fair.
The Doors were doing only 8 song sets in '68 on their European Tour. (which suprised me)
Maybe it was a technolgy thing - as sound systems improved and lights and pyrotechnics came in bands felt more able to put on a show - and all that expense and effort meant bands felt obliged to play more. Or maybe it was the gradual influence of bands like Pink Floyd raising the publics expectations.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Kevin on April 13, 2007, 03:00:10 PM
Another thought - the average age of people who attended those '66 Stones and Beatles concerts was very young. They were happy just to scream. By the 70's bands were playing to people in their twenties, not their teenies. No screaming, higher expectations....
Like most things in life there's probably no  one simple answer.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: raxo on April 13, 2007, 03:11:35 PM
I think that one of the main reasons could be that by mid 60s there were many bands in the same tour and it was a matter of time sharing the stage  :-/ ... and that didn't happen (or not so much) by late 60s/early 70s when tours with less bands were more than a common thing and a less risky busyNess to finance (seeing the gold mine that it seemed when the biggest groups played in stadiums, more rich people wanted to get more money too  ::) ... so more different tours were offered) ... then the bands could play more songs than only their hits and so ...
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Andy Smith on April 13, 2007, 09:39:47 PM
Quote from: 551
Help for Bobber counting hours:

According to the new Elizabeth Partridge book about John Lennon, the Beatles played "over 500 hours" after their first trip to Hamburg.  Also according to her, the Beatles were initially hired to play 4 hours during the week and 6 hours during the weekends.  However, I have a feeling that the Hamburg sessions in particular could go much longer, depending on who was wanting them to play.  So this is a pretty loose estimate to start with.

In the words of Python, "they use to work up 4 hours a day a week & when they got home, Brian Epstein
used to thrash them to sleep with his belt.  ;D
And you try to tell the young bands of today what the beatles did.. and they won't believe ya!! ;D
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: harihead on April 13, 2007, 10:33:23 PM
We used to dream of being thrashed to sleep with a belt...  ;D

They used to get up half an hour before they went to bed to play in Hamburg... No one believes that, either. ;)
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: pc31 on April 14, 2007, 10:19:07 AM
Quote from: 297
I think that one of the main reasons could be that by mid 60s there were many bands in the same tour and it was a matter of time sharing the stage  :-/ ... and that didn't happen (or not so much) by late 60s/early 70s when tours with less bands were more than a common thing and a less risky busyNess to finance (seeing the gold mine that it seemed when the biggest groups played in stadiums, more rich people wanted to get more money too  ::) ... so more different tours were offered) ... then the bands could play more songs than only their hits and so ...

there was always 2 or more on a tour..........usually 5 or 6......
(http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A9iby4acpiBGpEABKoajzbkF;_ylu=X3oDMTA4NDgyNWN0BHNlYwNwcm9m/SIG=11u32s672/EXP=1176631324/**http%3A//www.firstartsource.com/Art/R531.jpg)
(http://www.detroitsrvfanclub.com/Images/Alan%20Freed%20Boxer.jpg)
(http://www.detroitsrvfanclub.com/Images/Sam%20Cooke%20Boxing%20poster.jpg)
(http://www.whocollection.com/GerryPosterS.jpg)
(http://www.detroitsrvfanclub.com/Images/Buddy%20Holly%20poster.jpg)
(http://www.eddie-cochran.info/IMAGES/Programs_files/Scotland_poster.jpg)
(http://www.eddie-cochran.info/IMAGES/Programs_files/EDDIE_COCHRAN_GENE_VINCENT_1960_PROGRAMME_4.jpg)
(http://www.eddie-cochran.info/IMAGES/Programs_files/Newcastle_Empire.jpg)
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: pc31 on April 14, 2007, 10:35:02 AM
(http://www.news-antique.com/primages/Johnny_&_Jerry_Lee.JPG)
(http://www.tinytim.org/memorabilia/images/isle_of_wight_poster.jpg)
(http://www.firstartsource.com/Art/R357.jpg)
(http://www.maximumrnb.com/Framed%20Beatles%20007.jpg)
(http://www.maximumrnb.com/Framed%20Beatles%20004.jpg)
(http://www.maximumrnb.com/Framed%20Beatles%20003.jpg)
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: pc31 on April 14, 2007, 10:43:31 AM
(http://www.thecardcafe.com/images/362/500-500/29051.jpg)
http://www.peterice.com/Programmes.htm
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: harihead on April 14, 2007, 03:19:27 PM
What a fantastic collection of posters, PC31. Thanks!
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Andy Smith on April 14, 2007, 09:32:59 PM
GREAT STUFF PC31!!
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: pc31 on April 15, 2007, 05:10:09 AM
no thanks nessitated...the beatles should thank you for being such great fans....
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: BlueMeanie on April 15, 2007, 07:30:00 AM
The first one's interesting. I never realised that they used Wembley Stadium for concerts back in 1964? Which begs the question - why the hell did The Beatles play stadiums in the US but not in the UK?
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: pc31 on April 15, 2007, 03:14:05 PM
they weren't on a team???
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on May 04, 2007, 08:20:14 AM
Funny thing is that I always read that Brian was a 'natural business talent'. Looking at the deals he made in the Beatles' history, it is quite the opposite.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: BlueMeanie on May 04, 2007, 08:38:42 AM
He was a shopkeeper! Nice bloke, I'm sure, but some of his deals were awful (apart from the 25% he gave himself). But then he was learning as he went along. They were lucky they had him regardless of his inexperience, because anyone else would have severely ripped them off.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on May 04, 2007, 09:01:29 AM
Mmm. I guess he was honest to The Beatles and that's a big plus. On the other hand he knew from the start he had gold in his hands, but didn't seem to be prepared on things to come. The merchandising deal with Seltaeb was a complete disaster. Brian was naive, but presented himself as a business man. I guess the real guys in the business must have had a big laugh on him every now and then.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: BlueMeanie on May 04, 2007, 09:01:51 AM
Quote from: 284
([url]http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A9iby4acpiBGpEABKoajzbkF;_ylu=X3oDMTA4NDgyNWN0BHNlYwNwcm9m/SIG=11u32s672/EXP=1176631324/[/url]**http%3A//www.firstartsource.com/Art/R531.jpg)


Now this poster is really confusing the hell out of me. The Moody Blues headlining at Wembley Stadium, with The Kinks supporting. ON 15th May 1964. What's wrong with this picture?

The Moodies first single wasn't released until August '64 - Lose Your Money. Their first hit was Go Now in November '64.

The Kinks had a number one hit in August '64 with You Really Got Me.

And yet both these bands are playing Wembley Stadium in May '64? A venue that at that time would have held 90,000 people? And it's a Friday, not a Saturday.

So, two virtually unknown bands playing a venue that holds at least 90,000 on a friday afternoon! Either that poster's a fake, or there's something very fishy going on!


Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Kevin on May 04, 2007, 10:21:31 AM
According to Wiki the MB's only formed on 4th May 1964. It's must be a fake/misprint.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: BlueMeanie on May 04, 2007, 10:30:17 AM
Wiki also states that Wembley only became a music venue in 1972.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Kevin on May 04, 2007, 10:31:52 AM
Quote from: 483
The first one's interesting. I never realised that they used Wembley Stadium for concerts back in 1964? Which begs the question - why the hell did The Beatles play stadiums in the US but not in the UK?

The concerts weren't held in the stadium. They were held in the adjacent wembley Sports Arena which is indoors (you can see this in footage as well). The only capacity figure I could find was 12,000. The Stadium wasn't used until '72.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: on July 06, 2007, 09:49:58 AM
It's such a waste of space to include those fake American Posters (WEMBLEY - 'British Invasion'??) that can be purchased for around 6 pounds, but are of no value whatsoever. The venues/ dates/ billing are totally nonsensical!  PR

Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on July 06, 2007, 10:03:49 AM
Welcome to the forums, peterice.com...hope you'll enjoy them!   :)
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: raxo on July 06, 2007, 03:28:36 PM
Welcome to the forums, peterice.com ... hope you'll enjoy them!  :)
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Andy Smith on July 06, 2007, 10:40:30 PM
Welcome to the forums peterice.com,  :) Enjoy!
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: pc31 on July 07, 2007, 10:42:28 AM
Quote from: 185
According to Wiki the MB's only formed on 4th May 1964. It's must be a fake/misprint.
that does not seem right either...the mb's played the cavern too...in the early 60s.....
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: BlueMeanie on July 07, 2007, 11:43:43 AM
Quote from: 284
that does not seem right either...the mb's played the cavern too...in the early 60s.....

A previous incarnation of The Moodies supported The Beatles on April 15th 1963 at Tenbury Wells, Worcester. Denny and The Diplomats (Denny Laine) also supported them in '63. One source has them supporting The Beatles on an entire tour in 1964, but I can't even find that in Lewisohn. There is a photo of them all together but I can't find it. Maybe our Spanish friend can help us out.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on July 07, 2007, 09:53:46 PM
Oh, I have that picture. But I won't post it of course. Let our Spanish friend do it!  ;D
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: harihead on July 09, 2007, 03:35:09 AM
I stumbled across a fun quote while reading up on Larry Kane's book about touring with the Beatles in '64 & '65. Larry writes:
Quote
In 1964, the group was still very much aware of fame's fragility, and enjoying every minute.

"They kept getting asked, 'When's the bubble going to burst?' We'd joke about it in the back of the plane," Kane recalled. "It was on their minds, that they'd fade sometime."

But, he added, not everyone was convinced the Beatles were a flash in the pan.

"There were two people who thought they were the greatest band in the world -- Brian Epstein and John Lennon," Kane said. "Both of them felt that they'd last into the next century."

Both of them felt that they'd last into the next century. -- They didn't live to see it come true, but they certainly called that correctly. I think that's awesome. Cheers.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: The Swine on July 09, 2007, 12:49:35 PM
Quote from: 551
I stumbled across a fun quote while reading up on Larry Kane's book about touring with the Beatles in '64 & '65. Larry writes:


Both of them felt that they'd last into the next century. -- They didn't live to see it come true, but they certainly called that correctly. I think that's awesome. Cheers.

it is. thank you for that hirahead.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on December 16, 2008, 07:11:03 PM
From Times Online

Biteback: Brian Epstein film planned
Richard Brooks

There are at least five
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Geoff on December 17, 2008, 12:11:09 AM
Old Rolling Stone link from 2006:

[size=18]Beatles Manager Subject of Film[/size]
"The Fifth Beatle" will depict life of Brian Epstein
LYNNE MARGOLIS Posted Feb 02, 2006 1:00 PM / Rolling Stone (http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/9226300/beatles_manager_subject_of_film)


Brian Epstein, the man who shepherded the Beatles to stardom, will be the subject of the upcoming feature film The Fifth Beatle. The screenplay was written by Vivek Tiwary -- a producer on the Tony Award-winning Broadway revival of A Raisin in the Sun that starred Sean "Diddy" Combs -- and it conveys the rock & roll manager's life through historical scenes, dream sequences and hallucinations.

"It's closer to [Pink Floyd's] The Wall than Ray," says Tiwary, adding that Beatles music will not be an element. "That would overshadow the fact that I'm trying to tell Brian's story, not the Beatles story."

Tiwary became interested in Epstein twelve years ago, when he decided to pursue music management himself (Tiwary represents Columbia Records recording artist Ari Hest and founded the musician community site StarPolish). The American son of Indian immigrants, Tiwary particularly related to Epstein, a gay Jewish man in post-war England, as an outsider, and he set out to explore the methods of the man who rewrote the rules for developing bands.

"He was a staggering success," the filmmaker says. Indeed, in addition to discovering the Beatles at Liverpool's Cavern Club and launching them to world stardom, Epstein also managed a stable of other British Invasion bands, brought Jimi Hendrix to the U.K., booked the Who and Cream, produced films and even owned a luxury car dealership.

"I was hoping to find a blueprint for success in the music management world," Tiwary says. Instead, he found "this tremendously inspirational human story."

Among those Tiwary interviewed for the film were Epstein's former business partner Nat Weiss and his former assistant Joanne Peterson, who has been at work on a book called There's a Beatle in My Closet, which allegedly claims that Epstein had an affair with a member of the band. Based on his research, Tiwary believes Epstein was attracted to all the Beatles, in particular John Lennon, but he doesn't buy into -- nor does his script dramatize -- such an affair. "Epstein would have none of something like that," he says, "if only because it would have been so unprofessional."

The script also deals with Epstein's death by overdose of the drug Carbital. Although there has been much speculation that it was a suicide, Tiwary stands by the official explanation, that it was an accidental overdose. He notes that the drug buildup was gradual, and that it would have been uncharacteristic for such a meticulous businessman to take his life without leaving a will.

Tiwary, who has the blessing of the Epstein estate for The Fifth Beatle, hopes to attract a major director and would like to debut the film in Epstein's hometown of Liverpool in 2008, the year the city will serve as Europe's "Capital of Culture."
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Sondra on December 17, 2008, 02:34:35 AM
So is Jude Law still gonna play him? Sounds interesting anyway.

And how can it be closer to The Wall if they're not using Beatles' music? I mean, what music are they going to use? And what, is there gonna be some freaky, disturbing animation in it? Brian sitting in his apartment staring into space and morphing into a huge...um...you know. I'm trying to picture this here. I mean, The Wall didn't even really have dialogue! I doubt this movie will have any of those elements. Maybe this guy never actually saw The Wall.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: on December 29, 2008, 10:20:53 PM
(http://s3.amazonaws.com/findagrave/photos/2001/222/epsteinbrian.jpg)

he was... A JEW? oh yeah... he really was, I forgot  :-/ . whoever R.I.P Brian, but why so many people consider him as the 5th Beatle? especially when Paul likes to call Brian as the 5th Beatle?
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on March 06, 2010, 09:43:34 AM
BRIAN EPSTEIN IN VINTAGE BBC INTERVIEW: The recent stories about the financial problems of the BBC (and the possible closing of BBC6) and the possible downsizing of the website are sad because you can find some wonderful stuff hidden there. Here's (http://http//www.bbc.co.uk/archive/mersey/5184.shtml) a great half-hour interview with Brian Epstein from 1963. He talks about wanting to be an actor, how he connected with the Beatles, his love of classical music, the plans for the first Beatles film and more. Hopefully, stuff like this won't be lost. There is a second shorter Epstein profile (http://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/mersey/5181.shtml) that includes comments from Cilla Black and Gerry Marsden and some live music (sounds like Billy J. Kramer) in the background and recording session audio by Tommy Quickly, an hourlong chat (http://http//www.bbc.co.uk/archive/mersey/5204.shtml) with Cavern Club emcee Bob Wooler and a short interview from Gerry Marsden (http://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/mersey/5182.shtml).
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Daveyo on March 15, 2010, 07:57:08 AM
Mmm. I guess he was honest to The Beatles and that's a big plus. On the other hand he knew from the start he had gold in his hands, but didn't seem to be prepared on things to come. The merchandising deal with Seltaeb was a complete disaster. Brian was naive, but presented himself as a business man. I guess the real guys in the business must have had a big laugh on him every now and then.

I seem to cannot somehow agree of about Epstein being honest with the group.  Its a real dirty business and I have not heard any manager being honest to the groups they represented to this day.  Its well known that the contract that was signed by the Beatles group was basically a do or die when they first started trying to reach out to the public because no one else wanted to manage them or even get their music recorded.  His last contract was due to expire in 1967, but he died prior to its expiration.  The other post is correct by BlueMeanie about the 25% which is in that contract and each Beatle got I think a penny or less for every song sold.  Their pay was in British currency.  Last of all the Beatles were actually very much broke so it was Epstein who carried them and paid for all their expenses out of his pocket as it was reported which very few do and it does add up debt wise.  Once the group became popular his wealth grew by leaps and bounds.  He was basically their financial banker so to speak and negotiator to the Recording Companies and promotions etc.

I am sure He did not know in the beginning he had a band that would become immensely popular, in fact so much that even John Lennon said they were better than jesus, at the height of their pinnacle and fame, but had faith in the group and became very close together as friends and he stuck by them to the end (having two sides of himself).  A lot of bands were competing during this time period in the early 60's and I think it was the type of music beat they came out with being so very much different, and it stood out most from all the others in the crowd and the people started to noticed it and from there on out, it really picked up fast and Music itself changed almost overnight.  It just so happens they were in the right place and at the right time and things started to click together step by step.

Hey this is my first post outside of Paul McCartney forum topic.  Wow.

Daveyo
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Joost on March 15, 2010, 12:23:56 PM
Its a real dirty business and I have not heard any manager being honest to the groups they represented to this day.

Epstein was a 27 year old record store owner when he became their manager. It's not like he was your average seasoned record business executive.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: pc31 on March 21, 2010, 01:17:52 PM
eppy was an oppertunistic sort...i think he was more in it for himself than them....
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Daveyo on March 21, 2010, 02:13:52 PM
eppy was an oppertunistic sort...i think he was more in it for himself than them....

Yep especially when you see how the contracts were drawn up which in my opinion screwed the rest of the fab 4 of a lot of money.  Epstein was no dummy, and quite a schrewed fella.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: AngeloMysterioso on March 21, 2010, 03:30:12 PM
…Epstein was no dummy, and quite a schrewed fella…

So easy to say a posteriori.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: MerseySky on May 05, 2010, 12:55:25 AM
 If you remember that lump you felt in your throat and that fire you felt in your head the first time you heard The Beatles-- and something told you that, musically, this is IT!-- please come join us to help salute the man who pushed The Beatles' dream along. We are campaigning for the induction of Mr. Brian Epstein into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Here is the location of our FB site:

http://www.facebook.com/# (http://www.facebook.com/#)!/pages/Induct-Brian-Epstein-into-the-Rock-and-Roll-Hall-Of-Fame/111395682216647?ref=ts
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: eppylover on December 31, 2010, 09:11:17 PM
eppy was an oppertunistic sort...i think he was more in it for himself than them....
;sorry but you are wrong, so wrong about that, my dear.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on November 13, 2014, 09:04:01 PM
From Bill Harry:  I arranged for Brian to visit the Cavern and see the Beatles for the first time. He was to say "I hadn't seen the Beatles on any stage. They smoked as they played, they ate, talked and pretended to hit each other. They turned their backs on the audience and shouted at them and they laughed at private jokes." To me, that was the Beatles, it was a lot of fun, they were anarchic on stage. If they'd have kept on like that there wouldn't have been a Rolling Stones and a wrongly perceived preference by many youngsters later on that they loved the anarchic Stones in contract to the loveable moptop Beatles. Brian was right for the time, they wouldn't have been accepted by the establishment that ran the media - TV, radio, press as they were and it was only after they had been successful that the Rolling Stones were able to be manufactured by Andrew Loog Oldham.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: Bobber on July 17, 2016, 08:18:41 PM
(https://www.dropbox.com/s/saqnqdo6ywasrpw/20160716_115745.jpg?dl=0)

Travelling through Germany yesterday. First we passed a village called  Eppstein. Then followed a traffic jam. The car in front of us had NEMS on its plates.
Title: Re: Brian Epstein
Post by: KelMar on July 17, 2016, 09:19:19 PM
([url]https://www.dropbox.com/s/saqnqdo6ywasrpw/20160716_115745.jpg?dl=0[/url])

Travelling through Germany yesterday. First we passed a village called  Eppstein. Then followed a traffic jam. The car in front of us had NEMS on its plates.


All roads lead to The Beatles.  :)