DM's Beatles forums
Solo forums => Ringo Starr => Topic started by: Loco Mo on August 01, 2019, 12:51:09 AM
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I like this song that Ringo wrote and drummed on. Wow, how great it sounds! The Beatles records never had resonance or projection like on this recording. Their recordings are really weak by comparison. Even with digital remixing and remastering, it's impossible to match today's dynamic sound environments and techniques.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSKyQQr8slg# (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSKyQQr8slg#)
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Yeah, its a good song. I like it too. Steve Lukather with a monster guitar solo. Whats not to like?
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Thanks for the comment, tkitna. I really think Ringo is largely underestimated (even by me!). Ringo probably can play anything in any genre of music. He adds a lot of power to this song, BTW. He's not just quietly tapping time in the background, IMO.
I've often wondered if Ringo could play "Take Five" by Dave Brubeck. I have a suspicion Ringo could pull it off. Maybe it wouldn't sound like Joe Morello's version but Ringo could probably do it.
tkitna: A question for you: I know you are a drummer. Can you play "Take Five?" Even more challenging, can you play the flip side of it "Blue Rondo a la Turk?" You've got to have great timekeeping skills to keep up with that one and sustain the pulse perfectly throughout.
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Thanks for the comment, tkitna. I really think Ringo is largely underestimated (even by me!). Ringo probably can play anything in any genre of music. He adds a low of power to this song, BTW. He's not just quietly tapping time in the background, IMO.
I've often wondered if Ringo could play "Take Five" by Dave Brubeck. I have a suspicion Ringo could pull it off. Maybe it wouldn't sound like Joe Morello's version but Ringo could probably do it.
tkitna: A question for you: I know you are a drummer. Can you play "Take Five?" Even more challenging, can you play the flip side of it "Blue Rondo a la Turk?" You've got to have great timekeeping skills to keep up with that one and sustain the pulse perfectly throughout.
Hey Loco, NO I cant play 'Take Five'. Maybe in my younger days, but now I have a left hand full of suck. I'm definitely no Jazz drummer, plus I haven't picked up a stick in two years. My son can play it, but he's a young punk and he dabbles in Jazz and just about every genre of music. Ringo cant play it either. Jazz is a different beast and I've never heard or known Ringo to play it. Charlie Watts plays some Jazz, but he's not very good at it either. I think Jazz is the hardest music to play. Very, very technical.
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Thanks for the comment, tkitna. I really think Ringo is largely underestimated (even by me!). Ringo probably can play anything in any genre of music. He adds a low of power to this song, BTW. He's not just quietly tapping time in the background, IMO.
I've often wondered if Ringo could play "Take Five" by Dave Brubeck. I have a suspicion Ringo could pull it off. Maybe it wouldn't sound like Joe Morello's version but Ringo could probably do it.
tkitna: A question for you: I know you are a drummer. Can you play "Take Five?" Even more challenging, can you play the flip side of it "Blue Rondo a la Turk?" You've got to have great timekeeping skills to keep up with that one and sustain the pulse perfectly throughout.
Ringo play jazz ?
Not a chance, hahaha.
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Yeah. Much as I appreciate Richie’s drumming and his adaptability to different styles, Jazz wouldn’t be in his skill set by a long shot.
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I wish I could directly ask Ringo if he can play Take Five. I'd also like to ask him if it's really true that he can't play a roll. Legend is that he couldn't and wouldn't even try.
A roll is really just a set of 32nd notes (twice the speed of 16th notes). There are also short and long rolls starting at 5 strokes and up. It isn't that hard to play one. But - I don't know - didn't he do any rolls at all with the Beatles?
I'd also like to ask him why he didn't want to do any drum solos.
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I wish I could directly ask Ringo if he can play Take Five. I'd also like to ask him if it's really true that he can't play a roll. Legend is that he couldn't and wouldn't even try.
A roll is really just a set of 32nd notes (twice the speed of 16th notes). There are also short and long rolls starting at 5 strokes and up. It isn't that hard to play one. But - I don't know - didn't he do any rolls at all with the Beatles?
I'd also like to ask him why he didn't want to do any drum solos.
Ringo plays rolls all the time in Beatles songs. Me thinks he was just screwing with everyone. Single stroke rolls, buzz rolls, etc,,,he plays them.
Intro to 'She Loves You'
Paperback Writer
She Said She Said
Baby Your A Rich Man
etc,,,,
its endless
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They’re probably not quite rolls but Ringo’s fills on Oh Darling are among my favourites in catalogue. I hope the remix really brings them out. Love the drumming on that.
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I like this song that Ringo wrote and drummed on. Wow, how great it sounds! The Beatles records never had resonance or projection like on this recording. Their recordings are really weak by comparison. Even with digital remixing and remastering, it's impossible to match today's dynamic sound environments and techniques.
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSKyQQr8slg#[/url] ([url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSKyQQr8slg#[/url])
It's amazing how were all different I much prefer the sound of Beatles records, to me this this sounds like music by numbers made on something like Pro tools , Beatles recordings you can hear real instruments and how they are played, warts and all, this sounds like it was made by a computer with synthesizers, machines and sequencers, l really hate modern recordings, they are soulless, empty and baron, the bass doesn't even sound like a bass, Ringo's voice sounds like some kind of dreary mechanised robot, was he even there or was this recording made by a remote digital cyber producer using sampled everything ?
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your quote below is the best expression I want to make when people laugh at me when I say I don't like something from recent music history. The lack of heart and real instruments is what I typically say to them. Thank you for expanding on my thoughts...
It's amazing how were all different I much prefer the sound of Beatles records, to me this this sounds like music by numbers made on something like Pro tools , Beatles recordings you can hear real instruments and how they are played, warts and all, this sounds like it was made by a computer with synthesizers, machines and sequencers, l really hate modern recordings, they are soulless, empty and baron, the bass doesn't even sound like a bass, Ringo's voice sounds like some kind of dreary mechanised robot, was he even there or was this recording made by a remote digital cyber producer using sampled everything ?
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It's amazing how were all different I much prefer the sound of Beatles records, to me this this sounds like music by numbers made on something like Pro tools , Beatles recordings you can hear real instruments and how they are played, warts and all, this sounds like it was made by a computer with synthesizers, machines and sequencers, l really hate modern recordings, they are soulless, empty and baron, the bass doesn't even sound like a bass, Ringo's voice sounds like some kind of dreary mechanised robot, was he even there or was this recording made by a remote digital cyber producer using sampled everything ?
The advancement in technology can be both a blessing and a curse unfortunately. While it can add so much to so many things, it also takes away the human aspect or more fittingly,,,,,the soul.
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Thanks for the comment, tkitna. I really think Ringo is largely underestimated (even by me!). Ringo probably can play anything in any genre of music. He adds a lot of power to this song, BTW. He's not just quietly tapping time in the background, IMO.
I've often wondered if Ringo could play "Take Five" by Dave Brubeck. I have a suspicion Ringo could pull it off. Maybe it wouldn't sound like Joe Morello's version but Ringo could probably do it.
tkitna: A question for you: I know you are a drummer. Can you play "Take Five?" Even more challenging, can you play the flip side of it "Blue Rondo a la Turk?" You've got to have great timekeeping skills to keep up with that one and sustain the pulse perfectly throughout.
Hey Loco, NO I cant play 'Take Five'. Maybe in my younger days, but now I have a left hand full of suck. I'm definitely no Jazz drummer, plus I haven't picked up a stick in two years. My son can play it, but he's a young punk and he dabbles in Jazz and just about every genre of music. Ringo cant play it either. Jazz is a different beast and I've never heard or known Ringo to play it. Charlie Watts plays some Jazz, but he's not very good at it either. I think Jazz is the hardest music to play. Very, very technical.
Jazz drumming is definitely a specialty requiring extensive study and practice on the part of the drummer. As an example, Gene Krupa intensely studied cylinder recordings of African drumming in developing his style of syncopated drumming. As a result, we got this...
https://youtu.be/GwPvLMlGWPI (https://youtu.be/GwPvLMlGWPI)
At Carnegie Hall, he went on like that for over 12 minutes...
(https://dailymusicbreak.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Benny_Goodman_Carnegie_Hall2.jpeg)
https://youtu.be/ayNEiQvKqac (https://youtu.be/ayNEiQvKqac)
icon_king
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Benny Goodman hit a high Eb after a high C on his Bb clarinet at 9:16-9:25 at the Carnegie Hall Concert. icon_king
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It's amazing how were all different I much prefer the sound of Beatles records, to me this this sounds like music by numbers made on something like Pro tools , Beatles recordings you can hear real instruments and how they are played, warts and all, this sounds like it was made by a computer with synthesizers, machines and sequencers, l really hate modern recordings, they are soulless, empty and baron, the bass doesn't even sound like a bass, Ringo's voice sounds like some kind of dreary mechanised robot, was he even there or was this recording made by a remote digital cyber producer using sampled everything ?
Having worked a lot with Pro Tools it’s certainly a real problem. I’d suggest a few things in particular. The ease of digital editing makes it much too simple to cut out and drop in to correct errors. This has in turn made people very sensitive to mistakes so that they won’t let any performance flaw go through. Even worse, you don’t need, for instance, to play a full rhythm track. You just do a couple of perfect bars and copy-paste through the song. That makes for a very sterile recording. Compare that to Lennon’s way of playing rhythm.
Similarly it’s easy to make every individual track perfectly EQ-ed and compressed etc even before doing a final mix. So you have all these perfectly performed and sound sculpted tracks before you start putting it together. Again that can be positive but also can make the final mix sound clinical.
Another factor, but one more dependent on the artist, is the ease of doing direct injection of instruments (guitars and all) and then putting room-style synthetic effects on them. Or using computer generated instruments or loops. This is often done as, unless you’re working in a good studio, you won’t have a properly acoustically treated space to record instruments through mikes. So it’s a boon for home studios but doesn’t have the depth of instruments recorded more traditionally.
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^
Another reason I value my Beatles LPs I purchased when they were released.
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Good points Moog, l really can't listen to that Ringo track, way too clinical for me, but I'm a dinosaur, it's only my opinion.
;D
I still like the remastered stuff though, brings clarity to real recordings.
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Good points Moog, l really can't listen to that Ringo track, way too clinical for me, but I'm a dinosaur, it's only my opinion.
;D
I still like the remastered stuff though, brings clarity to real recordings.
Me too. I like all the remix and remastering. Not necessarily better. Just another way of listening to it with fresh ears.
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Me too. I like all the remix and remastering. Not necessarily better. Just another way of listening to it with fresh ears.
I like remastering, and replastering ha2ha
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I like remastering, and replastering ha2ha
You have to remix the plaster first
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I like remastering, and replastering ha2ha
You have to remix the plaster first
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/hxZo6se1k8A/maxresdefault.jpg)
https://youtu.be/UPBd8eHQqIw (https://youtu.be/UPBd8eHQqIw)
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Good points Moog, l really can't listen to that Ringo track, way too clinical for me, but I'm a dinosaur, it's only my opinion.
;D
I still like the remastered stuff though, brings clarity to real recordings.
I dont know. Pro Tools has its place. The Beatles sure could have used it on some of their recordings throughout the years. I enjoy some warts and blemishes to a point, but if something can be improved upon, why not do it?
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I dont know. Pro Tools has its place. The Beatles sure could have used it on some of their recordings throughout the years. I enjoy some warts and blemishes to a point, but if something can be improved upon, why not do it?
Oh yeah I really like pro tools. And for home studios it’s a boon. The quality of sound you can get with even rudimentary equipment is incredible. You can certainly use it and other software like any recording system and use the features to tweak here and there. Just have to be careful not to not to fall in love with all the things you can do and sap the life out of the music.
I think also people now have different expectations of recorded music. Genres like the various dance genres are usually fully synthesised so the sound is always pristine and every note precisely in its place. Not surprising when you can hear music with that clarity people start to expect it in all music they listen to. So it’s not just the equipment, many people want to hear that sound.
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To me, the sound I hear playing my original, and now over 50- year old Beatles LPs on my mid-level stereo system and turntable is the sound I enjoy most. The warmth of the sound provided by well-cared for vinyl LPs is so much more enjoyable than my 30 year-old CDs.
Remastering is okay with me too and I do like my 2009 STEREO and MONO box sets for casual listening. But I don't like the idea of remixing. I prefer to hear what I know The Beatles heard when they attending the engineering sessions at the studios. Remixing can go overboard as I think it did with the Love album which I listened to once and has since been collecting thirteen years of dust on my shelf. I know it won awards and Paul and Ringo said they liked it but I don't care for it at all.
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It's all down to personal opinion really.
But I don't like the way new music sounds it's too sterile, there's a lot of new progressive rock out, it sounds like they've used all 390 tracks lol
I was just listening before to kid Charlemagne by steely Dan it's a real pleasure to listen to the drums and bass player on that song , they were playing an awesome groove, its just so nice to know that they were actually playing it all through the song and it wasn't computerized.
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Bands in the 60's had Pro Tools back then, but it was called The Wrecking Crew.
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tkitna: Well, I re-listened to the songs you listed which you stated Ringo had executed rolls in. I think I should clarify how I think of rolls, which is in a strictly technical way. I took lessons for a few years and progressed to self-study for a few more years before I abandoned the instrument.
Basically, I don't hear Ringo playing the types of rolls that I played under formal instruction. Ringo is very good at the fills he creates but they don't approximate rolls to me. I think his fills vary in tempo/speed as fits the song. I can't say that I really hear 32nd or 64th notes in them. One song that comes close is "Nowhere Man" in which it seems he does a few quiet closed stroke rolls on the snare drum. He doesn't call attention to these and you probably don't hear them unless you are someone who focuses on listening to the drummer.
I enjoyed listening to the songs again. I am surprised by the recording differences between "She loves you" and "Sie Liebt Dich." The Beatles vocals are very prominent on the latter. One thing about their use of stereo (stereo on Sie liebt Dich; She loves you was mono), they seemed to favor the right channel. I think for that era stereo was seen as the separation of channels in which you would input various parts of the song. Later on, I think people starting recognizing that spreading sound across both channels was preferable because it created a better fuller sound. This is just my opinion though. I could give more examples (of which there are many from the 1960s) but I don't feel up to typing so much right now. It's probably not worth it anyway.
Thanks for reading and have a nice evening.
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I just noticed Ringo has an interesting drum pattern that resembles a roll on the remix of Oh, Darling (the Take 4 version). It's very interesting to really hear Ringo's drumming so clearly or better than I've ever heard it before.
The only reason I'm hesitant to label some of his stuff as rolls is because they don't seem fast enough because I can hear the gaps between the single alternating strokes he does even though, I guess, they're fast enough to be called rolls. Maybe it's just the speed issue with me.
Otherwise, I acknowledge that many of his fills are rolls.
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I don't think I've ever really "listened" to Ringo's drumming until I started reading all the comments about him on this Forum. It makes me appreciate him all the more.
This guy just instinctively knew what to play for any type of song the Beatles came up with. I don't know how he did it. Maybe it's some kind of rare talent or gift like people who can play piano without ever taking a lesson. They somehow find all the notes and remember them and know how to put them together. Maybe Ringo was like that with the drums. I heard it said that Buddy Rich could play anything he heard by another drummer after a single listen. Maybe Ringo had a similar ability. I don't know if this means he could've played like John Bonham, but who knows? It doesn't seem that Ringo had any interest in grandstanding as a drummer. He just wanted to play along and he did so very effectively and tastefully.
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Buddy Rich could play anything any other drummer could just because he was that good. Ringo has his own style and isnt technically good enough to do that.
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tkitna: I was trying to compare abilities. Rich could copy flawlessly. Starr could create spontaneously. I don't think Starr had to figure stuff out too much, he just sort of felt his beats and fills.
To this day, I am still amazed by Rich. Recently, I was listening to a version of "Apples." God, what a monster this guy was. IMO a lot of what he did was the rudiments of drumming. He had those mastered. Military drummers have got to love Rich for that reason alone!
tkitna: I wish I could listen to Starr play when he's alone with himself. When I was a drummer, I used to solo while solo. That involved a lot of rolling around the set including the cymbals. I'd love to hear what Starr sounds like when he does that. Hard to believe he wouldn't but then he's said more than once that he never practices.
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Did Ringo ever routinely play drum solo's during his Beatles shows. It was something he did when he was with Rory Storm and the Hurricanes.
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Pothos: I didn't think he did. You'd think somebody would have said something about how he sounded but I've never read any comments about anyone hearing a Ringo solo at a live concert.
I think the live audiences wanted to hear the Beatles sing so they probably wouldn't have wanted to listen to a drum solo.
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I think the live audiences wanted to hear the Beatles sing so they probably wouldn't have wanted to listen to a drum solo.
I think the size of an audience who wants to hear any drum solo is fairly small.
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I think the size of an audience who wants to hear any drum solo is fairly small.
Unless it's Jack dejohnette :)
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I'm a drummer and I even hate drum solos.
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I'm a drummer and I even hate drum solos.
Ginger Baker was the worst with Toad, went on for 20 minutes.
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Mind you I pretty much feel the same about long meandering guitar solos too.
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Mind you I pretty much feel the same about long meandering guitar solos too.
Some are just boring other tell a story such as the one in hotel California, I can listen to that also love Clapton's at the end of White Room.. Georges solos where I was interesting I thought
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Some are just boring other tell a story such as the one in hotel California, I can listen to that also love Clapton's at the end of White Room.. Georges solos where I was interesting I thought
For sure. Hotel California is a a great guitar piece. I’m thinking more of the live solos from some bands that just went on and on.
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For sure. Hotel California is a a great guitar piece. I’m thinking more of the live solos from some bands that just went on and on.
Yeah, just white noise.
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I like the guitar work in Hotel California, too. But is that really technically called soloing?
It feels so much a part of the song's melody line that I tend not to think of it as soloing but rather as an integral part of the song.
Solos suggest to me a free form style of improvisation that doesn't necessarily support the overall theme of a song but is rather a departure from it that somehow augments it without deviating so much as to sound like a different song.
David Gilmour's solo at the end of Paul's "No more lonely nights" really departs from the song's overall melody but somehow it fits and it sounds great. I think it's an absolutely fabulous solo for Fab Paul's fab song!
Now that I've written this, I'm not so sure of my original assumption. Am I wrong about this?
BTW: I wish Gilmour and Paul would play together again on another song.