DM's Beatles forums
Beatles forums => The Beatles => Topic started by: fendertele on November 30, 2021, 01:56:06 PM
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I've just got done watching Peter Jacksons documentary and noticed something that bothered me a little.
All throughout the doc I noticed if Paul had any idea or was discussing something that was a band decision his focus was constantly locked on John, even if George offered his opinion or take on something Paul would still be looking at John constantly it was almost like he felt/knew he only had to get John on his side and the deal was done. Paul is my favorite Beatle but I must admit I didn't enjoy seeing George being left out like this and was no surprise he was feeling the way he did at the time.
Ringo was quiet throughout and rarely expressed his opinion so there was no ghosting him, But George was constantly trying to offer his thoughts and seemed to be almost blanked by both Paul and John who seemed to be locked in a 2 way conversation with George talking at the side and they didn't even seem to look at him or acknowledge a lot of the times he was speaking.
This is something I had never picked up on any other clips/videos of The Beatles but then none was as close to their decision making process as the Let it be filming.
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All throughout the doc I noticed if Paul had any idea or was discussing something that was a band decision his focus was constantly locked on John, even if George offered his opinion or take on something Paul would still be looking at John constantly it was almost like he felt/knew he only had to get John on his side and the deal was done. . .
Ringo was quiet throughout and rarely expressed his opinion so there was no ghosting him, But George was constantly trying to offer his thoughts and seemed to be almost blanked by both Paul and John who seemed to be locked in a 2 way conversation with George talking at the side and they didn't even seem to look at him or acknowledge a lot of the times he was speaking.
I noticed this as well, and it made me sad and frustrated for George. I've read a lot about how hard it was for him to get his opinion, and songs, heard (literally and figuratively), and the documentary seemed to bear that out.
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I think a clue is in the private flowerpot conversation. Paul still sees John as the boss. If it doesn’t fly with him it doesn’t matter what George or Ringo think. They all still looked up to John.
There does seem to be a change of attitude, at least in the film we see, from first to third episode. Paul seems a lot more open to what George is saying in later stages of episode 2 and in 3. The discussion on arranging Get Back is a lot more constructive and cordial than the first episode one on Don’t Let Me Down. And Paul seems a lot more enthusiastic about George bringing in Old Brown Shoe then the chilly reception he gave I Me Mine.
But when all is said and done, pretty much since the Beatles started to this day there were only two people who could get away with telling Paul to do something, John and George Martin.
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I think it was because of the Lennon/McCartney songwriting partnership, they still sometimes finished each others songs off. George was still seen as a sort of apprentice songwriter, Old Brown Shoe, For You Blue, I Me Mine were not great songs.
I dont think Paul and George got on well together. I though it was apparent in the anthology in George's garden.
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Although he also was bringing in great stuff like All Things Must Pass and Something. While John, aside from Don’t Let Me Down was bringing in old stuff and jams like Dig It or Dig a Pony. I could see why George would get a little peeved.
One interesting thing I thought though was how long All Things Must Pass was still in the mix for the show and album. It seems like it didn’t get completely ditched til quite late. So perhaps the impression that they weren’t caring about George’s stuff wasn’t completely accurate either.
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Although he also was bringing in great stuff like All Things Must Pass and Something. While John, aside from Don’t Let Me Down was bringing in old stuff and jams like Dig It or Dig a Pony. I could see why George would get a little peeved.
One interesting thing I thought though was how long All Things Must Pass was still in the mix for the show and album. It seems like it didn’t get completely ditched til quite late. So perhaps the impression that they weren’t caring about George’s stuff wasn’t completely accurate either.
Actually when you think about it, All Things Must Pass wouldve been a very apt title for the last album. Its a puzzle, George's 2 songs on the album were poor imo but they couldve used ATMP and Something instead.
John also had Across The Universe, a song he considered amongst his best....Ive always like Dig A Pony, great riff, and melody for me. Paul owns the album though.
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Paul is my favorite Beatle but I must admit I didn't enjoy seeing George being left out like this and was no surprise he was feeling the way he did at the time.
Ringo was quiet throughout and rarely expressed his opinion so there was no ghosting him, But George was constantly trying to offer his thoughts and seemed to be almost blanked by both Paul and John who seemed to be locked in a 2 way conversation with George talking at the side and they didn't even seem to look at him or acknowledge a lot of the times he was speaking.
Nice to see you back, fendertele!
George was very supportive of Ringo as seen in this clip...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NO5XAB1PLGU# (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NO5XAB1PLGU#)
The two of them were always in the same boat and became close mates.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LBJoj4Vyb0# (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LBJoj4Vyb0#)
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I think Something and All things must pass were not as far along as the others to make the final cut.
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Actually when you think about it, All Things Must Pass wouldve been a very apt title for the last album. Its a puzzle, George's 2 songs on the album were poor imo but they couldve used ATMP and Something instead.
John also had Across The Universe, a song he considered amongst his best....Ive always like Dig A Pony, great riff, and melody for me. Paul owns the album though.
Yes but Across the Universe had already been recorded for Spike Milligan’s album. So it wasn’t new to the sessions. I like Dig a Pony too but I think it’s on a similar level to For You Blue and Old Brown Shoe. A bit of fun with the guitar riffs which are great. But not a huge standout in Johns catalogue to me.
Undoubtedly Paul was just oozing material at this stage. I love how he’d sit down and play Another Day or Back Seat of My Car. You can imagine John and George just thinking, slow down mate!
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I think Something and All things must pass were not as far along as the others to make the final cut.
Certainly something was a work in progress. I think they spent quite a bit of time on ATMP but didn’t get it to finished arrangement stage. But clearly they were still considering it for the album based on the playlist they went through.
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Sorry this wasn't purely based on his song offerings as I know once they had their songwriting partnership there would always be that tight bond between John and Paul.
All through the the doc when there was decisions to be made or input required for anything non song related he would offer his take and whilst doing so neither Paul or John even looked at him half the time, and continued to look at each other, sometimes they even spoke over him. John did it a lot but no where near as much as Paul did maybe I'm reading into it too much but I have went back and re-watched as well.. why not lol and Paul spent most of the 8 hours ignoring George.
Just look for most discussions they had regarding the final show when sat round in a group for examples of this.
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Nice to see you back, fendertele!
George was very supportive of Ringo as seen in this clip...
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NO5XAB1PLGU#[/url] ([url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NO5XAB1PLGU#[/url])
The two of them were always in the same boat and became close mates.
Hello there :) Nice to see some folk from back in the day :)
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LBJoj4Vyb0#[/url] ([url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LBJoj4Vyb0#[/url])
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Yes but Across the Universe had already been recorded for Spike Milligan’s album. So it wasn’t new to the sessions. I like Dig a Pony too but I think it’s on a similar level to For You Blue and Old Brown Shoe. A bit of fun with the guitar riffs which are great. But not a huge standout in Johns catalogue to me.
Undoubtedly Paul was just oozing material at this stage. I love how he’d sit down and play Another Day or Back Seat of My Car. You can imagine John and George just thinking, slow down mate!
Im a big fan of Dig A Pony, I think its a really great song with a great chorus, musically superb, Im a sucker for 6/8 time. :)