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Author Topic: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?  (Read 14012 times)

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tkitna

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #120 on: January 20, 2012, 09:14:07 PM »

no. not in the strictest sense. but it is my belief that Pete Best was very unlikely the throw-away drummer for the beatles that some people likes to pretend he was.
 ;yes

Any reasoning behind that?
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tkitna

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #121 on: January 20, 2012, 09:27:11 PM »

@ Kitna...
where was it ever stated that Ringo was the best drummer in Liverpool?

"Ringo was simply the best drummer in Liverpool. Ringo also had native wit. He didn't know when he was being funny. Ringo Talked in titles. We had to follow him around with a notebook and pencil. You never know what he would say next." -- Paul McCartney


This is from Wikipedia, but its about right in my opinion.

Quote
Musically, Best has been judged to have had a limited rhythmic vocabulary that was seen as holding the other three band members back from their collective musical growth. Martin (see above) deemed Best's drumming to be inadequate for a recording. As stated in Bob Spitz's 2005 biography, "All Pete could do was play 'Fours'", a style of drumming that uses kick drum notes on every quarter note to hold down the beat. Spitz's book also contains engineer Ron Richards' account of his failed attempts to teach Best somewhat more complicated beats for different songs.[41] Critic and Beatles historian Richie Unterberger described Best's drumming at the Decca session as "thinly textured and rather unimaginative",[35] and said that Best "pushes the beat a little too fast for comfort".[36] Unterberger thought Starr to be "more talented".[70] Beatles critic Alan W. Pollack compared the Best, Starr, and Andy White versions of "Love Me Do", and concluded that Best was "an incredibly unsteady and tasteless drummer" on his version.[71] Beatles historian Ian MacDonald, recounting the Decca audition, said that "Best's limitations as a drummer are nakedly apparent".[72] MacDonald notes of the 6 June EMI audition that "...this audition version [of "Love Me Do"] shows one of the reasons why Pete Best was sacked: in moving to the ride cymbal for the first middle eight, he slows down and the group falters".[73]

Yeah, Pete was great.

BeatlesAtTheirBest

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #122 on: January 20, 2012, 10:30:11 PM »

"Ringo was simply the best drummer in Liverpool. Ringo also had native wit. He didn't know when he was being funny. Ringo Talked in titles. We had to follow him around with a notebook and pencil. You never know what he would say next." -- Paul McCartney


This is from Wikipedia, but its about right in my opinion.

Yeah, Pete was great.


Ringo was so great he screwed the up timing of"Love Me Do" the first time he tried it just like Pete did.  Not only did George Martin think Ringo screwed it up, so did Paul McCartney.  Martin had to bring in professional studio drummer Andy White the following week to get it right.  At that session, they had Ringo Starr, the "best drummer in Liverpool" play tamborine!!!

Isn't that what Yoko used to play?

« Last Edit: January 20, 2012, 10:35:05 PM by BeatlesAtTheirBest »
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nimrod

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #123 on: January 20, 2012, 10:32:49 PM »

Pete Best sacked because of his mom?

No I dont think so, its obvious that 3/4 of the band wanted a new drummer, thats it really, George Martins remark just gave them the ammunition to fire him, they played with him endlessly in Hamburg, they lived with him and at the end they decided he wasnt right for the band, even if his mum had the Casbah and even if he was good looking..
When I listen to Petes version of Love Me Do, he loses time in the middle 8, the biggest job of any drummer is surely to keep time, for me this is a major clue to what the other 3 were hearing all the time.

They decided they wanted Ringo in, it was the bands decision, they decided Pete wasnt right for The Beatles.

I personally feel very very sorry for Pete, but these things happen and you have to be strong and accept it, Pete did and good on him

IMO any film should explain to fans that the other 3 didnt want him in the band. That was their right and their decision.
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tkitna

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #124 on: January 21, 2012, 12:53:47 AM »


Ringo was so great he screwed the up timing of"Love Me Do" the first time he tried it just like Pete did.  Not only did George Martin think Ringo screwed it up, so did Paul McCartney.  Martin had to bring in professional studio drummer Andy White the following week to get it right.  At that session, they had Ringo Starr, the "best drummer in Liverpool" play tamborine!!!

Hey, i'm just quoting what Paul said. If Ringo messed up 'love Me Do' we can only imagine how bad Petes destruction of the song was.

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Isn't that what Yoko used to play?

She was probably better than Pete too.

Hey, did you get any of those great examples of Petes superior playing for us all to hear yet?

Yeah, I didnt think so.


tkitna

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #125 on: January 21, 2012, 12:58:06 AM »

Again with this age old question, if Pete was so good, why werent people and bands knocking down his door for his services? Did he pull a Brian Wilson and lay in bed all depressed for 2 or 3 years? This is the question I want answered the most.

Still looking for this answer too. Please, somebody,,,anybody answer this for me.

**sound of crickets**

7 of 13

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #126 on: January 21, 2012, 01:33:18 AM »

Any reasoning behind that?
yes. because i can.  roll:) i am speaking only from my limited experience as a hand drummer and musician. 
 ;sorry
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BeatlesAtTheirBest

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #127 on: January 21, 2012, 01:55:18 AM »

Still looking for this answer too. Please, somebody,,,anybody answer this for me.

**sound of crickets**

This question was already answered once before, so pay attention tkitna.  Pete did not pull a Brian Wilson.  He was asked to join Lee Curtis & The All-Stars.  In January 1962, The Beatles with Pete Best narrowly won The Mersey Beat Poll as the most popular group in Germany (narrowly defeating Ringo's group Rory Storm & The Hurricaines).    in January 1963, just 4 months after Pete was replaced by Ringo, The Beatles won again in a very close vote.  This time they narrowly beat out the new hottest band in Liverpool - Lee Curtis & The All-Stars featuring Pete Best who finished 2nd in the poll.

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nimrod

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #128 on: January 21, 2012, 02:01:34 AM »

This question was already answered once before, so pay attention tkitna.  Pete did not pull a Brian Wilson.  He was asked to join Lee Curtis & The All-Stars.  In January 1962, The Beatles with Pete Best narrowly won The Mersey Beat Poll as the most popular group in Germany (narrowly defeating Ringo's group Rory Storm & The Hurricaines).    in January 1963, just 4 months after Pete was replaced by Ringo, The Beatles won again in a very close vote.  This time they narrowly beat out the new hottest band in Liverpool - Lee Curtis & The All-Stars featuring Pete Best who finished 2nd in the poll.

is this the same Lee Curtis band that never had a hit ?
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tkitna

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #129 on: January 21, 2012, 02:14:44 AM »

is this the same Lee Curtis band that never had a hit ?

Or the same Lee Curtis band that i've never heard of. I'm overwhelmed by their success. Must have been that great drummers doing.

tkitna

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #130 on: January 21, 2012, 02:19:27 AM »

yes. because i can.  roll:) i am speaking only from my limited experience as a hand drummer and musician. 
 ;sorry

First of all, you can stop posting sorry after everyone of your comments. We are all aware that you are sorry.

Secondly, stating that you are a musician via hand drumming isnt helping your case.

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #131 on: January 21, 2012, 02:27:13 AM »

...can't you at least keep this friendly, Kitna?
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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #132 on: January 21, 2012, 02:30:06 AM »

LEE CURTIS & THE ALL-STARS (with PETE BEST) LET'S STOMP-1963
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nimrod

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #133 on: January 21, 2012, 02:31:53 AM »

...can't you at least keep this friendly, Kitna?

Yes come on guys nada surf is right lets keep it friendly please, otherwise it just goes downhill....no personal abuse.

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tkitna

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #134 on: January 21, 2012, 02:35:13 AM »

...can't you at least keep this friendly, Kitna?

Your right. I apologize to everybody as i've been over the top lately. Although 7 of 13 and I have had a long, ugly history, he didnt deserve my childish name calling and I deleted that part accordingly. I'll watch the swearing too.

Sorry.

BeatlesAtTheirBest

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #135 on: January 21, 2012, 02:43:15 AM »

You just keep repeating yourself. Your basically saying that Petes biggest contribution to the band was that he accepted the drumming position when nobody else would (wonder why he even accepted since the band was so sh*tty as you say. I guess he had trouble finding work?). Just accepting the position isnt much of a contribution. What did he do that was so great? If the guy was actually writing songs, or teaching the guys music theory then I would say he was a great contributor. Just because he was an adequate drummer and helped the Beatles get girl private due to his looks, doesnt mean he was a major contributor. What did he do that was so musically brilliant? As far as I can see, he was basically a drummer in a cover band that had a few originals at the time. Thats not hard. If I played the same songs night after night after night, I would be just as adequate.

No you wouldn't, because you are one of those guys who loves to run his mouth, swearing all the time and acting like your opinion is the final word on any topic you decide to throw in your 2 cents on.  You talk a lot, but you never really do anything, do you?  What have you ever actually done to be such an expert on everything?  Seriously.  Everyone is entitled to have an opinion, but what have you ever done in your life that would make you qualified to be a know it all expert on what it takes to be a part of a gigging band for two years?   You wouldn't have a clue.  Pete did a lot more than just "accept the position" of drummer in The Beatles.  He spent more time playing live for The Beatles in his 2 years than Ringo did in his entire career, at times drew more paying fans to The Beatles shows than the other 3 put together, created a beat that became the new Liverpool sound, helped the group become the most popular group in 2 different cities in 2 different countries with record deals in 2 different countries and also helped manage the groups business affairs.  That's more than just accepting a position.

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Show me some examples of how f***ing good this guy is. I mean, I have albums of his and almost everything that can be heard from his Beatle days thats offered and i'm not seeing this great talent. Hell, when the guys wrote originals and let him lay the beat to the songs, we ended up with his version of 'Love Me Do' which sucked beyond belief. Prove your point already instead of just saying he joined the band and thats enough.

I've proved my point a dozen different way on many different posts.  You usually skip right past the facts of my answers and just keep throwing out attack questions.  I answer all of them and the the whole process repeats itself.  Pete's first take at "Love Me Do" sucked beyond belief?  So did Ringo's first take at "Love Me Do".  He couldn't keep the timing right and had the exact same problem Pete had.  George Martin thought so.  So did Paul McCartney.  Ringo's first attempt at "Love Me Do" sucked so bad that Martin booked studio drummer Andy White he following week to try and get it recorded right.  They let Ringo play tamborine (same instrument Yoko played).

You asked for examples of Pete's best work with the Beatles?

"Our best work was never recorded.   We were at our best when we played the dance halls of Liverpool & Hamburg.  The world never saw that.  Later on we became technically efficent recording artists."

-John Lennon


 
Quote
Thats awesome. The guy was decent looking, played the drums hard, and made a spectacle out of himself so he recieved the most attention. Whoopee. Surely he must have been the talent in the group. I mean, look how his career took off after he was canned.

He didn't make a spectacle out of himself as you say, but at times he did draw more fans than the other three combined!!!  Drawing fans is an important part of being a gigging band.  Something you know nothing about or else you wouldn't make such silly comments.  But no matter how good a job a drummer does, you need hit songs.  Best found one Hall of Fame songwriting team, he wasn't able to find another.   He isn't alone there.  No other drummer in the history of the world found another Lennon & McCartney either.

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Well since you just mentioned two drummers that are better than Ringo, I suppose we can say yes to your question.

I asked you if The Beatles were to have later sacked Ringo and replaced him with Anysley Dunbar or Mitch Mitchell, would that mean Ringo sucked and didn't contribute anything to The Beatles too.  You say yes???!!!  That's just a stupid way at looking at things.  Whatever Ringo contributed, he contributed.  Just like whatever Pete contributed he contributed.  Just because you sack someone, that doesn't erase the contributions the person made before they were sacked.

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Let me break it down for you. Once Brian got a hold of them, they werent playing sh*tty clubs everynight so yeah, the fluidness and skills of the actual playing may have broken down, but who wants to listen to that crap compared the 'A Hard Days Night'?


They were selling out shows in 2 different countries with fans standing in line for days before the show just to have a chance to get in.  It looks like a whole lot of people wanted to hear that "crap" as you call it.


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They wanted to make it big and they sure as hell werent going to do so by continuing their raunchy stage act and wearing leather jackets.  I think their success proves that point.  Its not hard to imagine that they had a better time with no supervision.  Dont we all?

The point wasn't when did they have the most fun.   The point was when were The Beatles playing at their best as a live act.  John Lennon says they were at their best during the time Pete Best was the drummer.
 
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Well the fact that Ringo was still labeled as the best drummer in Liverpool even when Pete was in the Beatles may have had something to do with it and sure, I think Ringo helped the band out by being a better drummer. He was tighter and more innovative for sure. I havent heard anything from Pete Best that would change my mind.

Who says Ringo Starr was the best drummer in Liverpool?   You? 

Quote
Again with this age old question, if Pete was so good, why werent people and bands knocking down his door for his services? Did he pull a Brian Wilson and lay in bed all depressed for 2 or 3 years? This is the question I want answered the most.

This question was already answered once before, so pay attention tkitna.  Pete did not pull a Brian Wilson and lay in bed for 2-3 years.  He was asked to join Lee Curtis & The All-Stars.  In January 1962, The Beatles with Pete Best had narrowly won The Mersey Beat Poll as the most popular group in Germany (narrowly defeating Ringo's group Rory Storm & The Hurricaines).    In January 1963, just 4 months after Pete was replaced by Ringo, The Beatles won again in a very close vote.  This time they narrowly beat out the new hottest band in Liverpool - Lee Curtis & The All-Stars featuring Pete Best who finished 2nd in the poll.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2012, 03:07:07 AM by BeatlesAtTheirBest »
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BeatlesAtTheirBest

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #136 on: January 21, 2012, 02:46:27 AM »

Or the same Lee Curtis band that i've never heard of. I'm overwhelmed by their success. Must have been that great drummers doing.

Again, drummers don't make hit groups.  Singers & great songwriting does.  They didn't have a Lennon / McCartney in Lee Curtis & The All-Stars so the immediate success that had after adding Pete Best was short lived.  I never said Pete Best was The Beatles (although he was the most popular).  All I have said was that he made a significant contribution to the group, and his contribution is played down or outright dismissed by The Beatles themselves and by people like you.

« Last Edit: January 21, 2012, 02:58:58 AM by BeatlesAtTheirBest »
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7 of 13

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #137 on: January 21, 2012, 02:55:56 AM »

Your right. I apologize to everybody as i've been over the top lately. Although 7 of 13 and I have had a long, ugly history, he didnt deserve my childish name calling and I deleted that part accordingly. I'll watch the swearing too.

Sorry.
one thousand times no. you don't bother me one bit tkitna, at the very least your comments are thought provoking though i do think some of it is overkill. be yourself man, that's the least you can do.
First of all, you can stop posting sorry after everyone of your comments. We are all aware that you are sorry.

Secondly, stating that you are a musician via hand drumming isnt helping your case.
again, i just happen to let the abundant colorful smileys speak for themselves.  :-\ and two to be perfectly honest hand drumming just humongously improved my skills as a guitarist and keeping a basic steady beat.
 ;yes
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BeatlesAtTheirBest

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #138 on: January 21, 2012, 03:02:23 AM »

Hey, i'm just quoting what Paul said. If Ringo messed up 'love Me Do' we can only imagine how bad Petes destruction of the song was.

You don't have to imagine.
]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwzY0XYVyTk#]

« Last Edit: January 21, 2012, 03:13:27 AM by BeatlesAtTheirBest »
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7 of 13

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Re: Pete Best sacked because of his mom?
« Reply #139 on: January 21, 2012, 03:06:41 AM »

You don't have to imagine.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwzY0XYVyTk#
Pete Best yeah. that man has rhythm. no doubt about it.
 ;yes
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