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Author Topic: The Most English Beatle ?  (Read 5534 times)

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Sondra

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #60 on: June 25, 2009, 02:24:00 PM »

I was speaking more about the term Salad Bowl. People don't use it. If they're gonna use a term, they'll more likely use Melting Pot. But neither completely defines how people deal with cultural diversity in this country. Out her in Los Angeles, it's very much a melting pot. Yes there are sections where people of certain ethnicity stick together, but that's not always based on ethnic pride. Most people out here are mixed and don't really think a lot about their heritage. Back East, it's more common to come across people who are 100% Irish or 100% something else. And they are very much into their ethnicity and even wear it like a badge of honor sometimes. Because this country is so HUGE, different regions behave in different ways. One term cannot possible define a country this big. And it's always changing. Of course. These are just my general impressions. Which people may or may not agree with.
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Kevin

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #61 on: June 25, 2009, 02:25:41 PM »

Quote from: 1393
I don`t think Great Britain will break up. It`s all politics and it is not that simple.
[/quote

Hi Jane. Do you know how much the Scots hate the english? They regard us as a colonising power (even though the truth is they sold their souls for a few pieces of silver.) The Scottish Indepence Party is the strongest in Scotland.
They believe they can be prosperous as is Norway and was Iceland. And they'll seek shelter within the EU.
Northern Ireland is just a pain in the arse.
England will do fine on it's own. The celtic fringes suck more tax out of England than any money they give back. I think a breakup would see England economically, morally and socially stronger.
We only play a "significant role in world politics" because we suck up to the US. This has given us nothing but trouble and I think most English would gladly be out of it. We can exert our influence via the EU. Though I agree that loss of perceived influence may be what stops the ruling classes going along with this. But that's why God gave us revolutions.
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Jane

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #62 on: June 25, 2009, 02:31:04 PM »

Thank you, Kevin for your insight!
I`ve read an article from the Times which says that "nobody from Newport (England) had a problem with Britishness. In Newport (Wales) some of the Welsh felt British, though others prefer to call themselves European. But it was in Newport-on-Tay (Scotland), that we found the greatest reluctance to be British."
Is the word British used now or is it replaced by the word European? Do you call yourselves Europeans? Or rather not?
The thing is that when I was in England at Surrey University in November 2007 our professor, an Englishman, when answering my question whether I should say "English" emphasised that I should say British. So according to him the word British still exists.  
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Kevin

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #63 on: June 25, 2009, 02:38:40 PM »

We definately DO NOT regard ourselves as europeans. English people can't decide between english/british, probably because being the majority ethnic group for us their is no difference. An upper class professor would regard a British tag as fine, because he's in the dominant group and that means being like him. In Scotland adults attack seven year olds for wearing an English football shirt. To them British equals english which equals wankers.
I think most white middle class folk struggle with the whole ethnicity thing, because they generally are the dominant group and can't see what the fuss is all about. They say "we're all the same" because for them "same" means being like them.
I don't think ethnic groups stick together because of pride. They do so because that is what humans do. Doesn't LA have Chinatown, Koreatowwn and the occassional race riot?
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Jane

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #64 on: June 25, 2009, 02:56:17 PM »

Quote from: 185
Hi Jane. Do you know how much the Scots hate the english? They regard us as a colonising power (even though the truth is they sold their souls for a few pieces of silver.) The Scottish Indepence Party is the strongest in Scotland.
They believe they can be prosperous as is Norway and was Iceland. And they'll seek shelter within the EU.
Northern Ireland is just a pain in the arse.
England will do fine on it's own. The celtic fringes suck more tax out of England than any money they give back. I think a breakup would see England economically, morally and socially stronger.
We only play a "significant role in world politics" because we suck up to the US. This has given us nothing but trouble and I think most English would gladly be out of it. We can exert our influence via the EU. Though I agree that loss of perceived influence may be what stops the ruling classes going along with this. But that's why God gave us revolutions.

Yes, Kevin, I understand you. "The leader of the Scottish nationalists looks to Europe as Scotland`s new stage." They do not see that it is England that makes them strong.
No revolutions, I protest!

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Kevin

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #65 on: June 25, 2009, 02:58:12 PM »

Don't know if this had made the news elsewhere, but a entire Rumanian community in Northern Ireland was forced from its homes by threats and attacks from locals and were forced to take shelter in a church. They have now fled the country.
This is not a Britishness that I recognise.
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BlueMeanie

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #66 on: June 25, 2009, 03:00:11 PM »

Quote from: 1393
Thank you, Kevin for your insight!
I`ve read an article from the Times which says that "nobody from Newport (England) had a problem with Britishness. In Newport (Wales) some of the Welsh felt British, though others prefer to call themselves European. But it was in Newport-on-Tay (Scotland), that we found the greatest reluctance to be British."
Is the word British used now or is it replaced by the word European? Do you call yourselves Europeans? Or rather not?
The thing is that when I was in England at Surrey University in November 2007 our professor, an Englishman, when answering my question whether I should say "English" emphasised that I should say British. So according to him the word British still exists.  

^ Technically you should say British. On a passport you're meant to give your country of birth as United Kingdom, and your nationality as British. Most Scots and Welsh would say they are Scottish or Welsh. There seems to be a growing number of people in England who give their nationality as English, rather than British. As a Brit living abroad I generally say I'm English rather than British. Most people outside of the UK don't really understand the difference between Great Britain, United Kingdom, and The British Isles. In fact most Danes seem to think that Ireland is part of Great Britain. Fair enough, it took me a while to work out the difference between Scandinavia and 'Nordic Countries'.

On the possible dissolution of the UK, I can't see it happening any time soon. The Scots want out, and have done for as far back as I remember. I'm not sure how I would feel about them splitting from GB as I'm partly Scottish myself (born and bred in England). I don't honestly think the Welsh would do very well on their own; we'd certainly benefit from them splitting. We could easily leave N. Ireland to their own devices - no great loss - but a majority of them want to stay part of the UK.

I think England would come out of a split in pretty healthy condition, and I too favour some kind of slimmed down Monarchy. It is, and has always been great PR for the country, and a massive money spinner tourism wise.
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Jane

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #67 on: June 25, 2009, 03:17:08 PM »

Quote from: 185
We definately DO NOT regard ourselves as europeans. English people can't decide between english/british, probably because being the majority ethnic group for us their is no difference. An upper class professor would regard a British tag as fine, because he's in the dominant group and that means being like him. In Scotland adults attack seven year olds for wearing an English football shirt. To them British equals english which equals wankers.
I think most white middle class folk struggle with the whole ethnicity thing, because they generally are the dominant group and can't see what the fuss is all about. They say "we're all the same" because for them "same" means being like them.
I don't think ethnic groups stick together because of pride. They do so because that is what humans do. Doesn't LA have Chinatown, Koreatowwn and the occassional race riot?

1. A quote: "Many Scots and not a few Welsh believe that Britishness is no more than a disguised version of Englishness." That is why they are against it. But if they break up from Britain they will stick more to Europe and in the end will be called European. So they will change one umbrella name to another, so what is all the fuss about?
2. Another reason why people stick together is psychology. In the Soviet times there were a lot of intermarriages, there was no problem with that. While now people from the former Soviet republics who have different ethnicity marry their group. My parents have friends who live in Russia and who are Dagestan-Belarus, Tatar-Russian (there are very many such couples), Ukranian-Russian (every other), Ossetian-Russian, Latvian-Russian. Now young people stick together. Especially those from the former Georgian Republics and surely muslims, who never marry other "religions".
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Kevin

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #68 on: June 25, 2009, 03:25:01 PM »

Quote from: 1393

1. A quote: "Many Scots and not a few Welsh believe that Britishness is no more than a disguised version of Englishness." That is why they are against it. But if they break up from Britain they will stick more to Europe and in the end will be called European. So they will change one umbrella name to another, so what is all the fuss about?

But I think the Scots see British as a termed forced upon them (it's not - they joined the Union by choice, but they don't see it that way.) and equate it with oppression
Whereas if they adopt European they'll see that as a choice, and will equate it with equality (even though that might not be the reality)
The word British has bad connotations for the Scots. The word European doesn't. So I think there is a big difference.
The Russian/Soviet thing interests me, but I hate long posts so I'll talk about that later.
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Jane

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #69 on: June 25, 2009, 03:28:31 PM »

Quote from: 483
Most people outside of the UK don't really understand the difference between Great Britain, United Kingdom, and The British Isles. In fact most Danes seem to think that Ireland is part of Great Britain. Fair enough, it took me a while to work out the difference between Scandinavia and 'Nordic Countries'.

People used to be taught that England, Britain, Great Britain, The United Kingdom all were one and the same thing. Old textbooks said so. Now I hope people make the distinction. But I can`t see the difference between Great Britain and the United Kingdom. ???

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BlueMeanie

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #70 on: June 25, 2009, 03:43:39 PM »

Quote from: 1393

People used to be taught that England, Britain, Great Britain, The United Kingdom all were one and the same thing. Old textbooks said so. Now I hope people make the distinction. But I can`t see the difference between Great Britain and the United Kingdom. ???


Great Britain consists of England, Scotland and Wales. The United Kingdom is Great Britain and Northern Ireland. The British Isles is just a geographical name for all the islands that make up Great Britain and Irleland.
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Jane

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #71 on: June 25, 2009, 03:50:35 PM »

Quote from: 483
The United Kingdom is Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

Oh, yes! Thank you!

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lucy~(-_-*...

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Re: The Most English Beatle ?
« Reply #72 on: October 14, 2009, 12:23:10 PM »

ringo is the most english beatles and that's final! 8)
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