What I mean by this is that Help!, by itself, people feel is a good album.  However, when compared to ANY album after it, it seems to get a bit of a shaft.  "Help! is good, but the rest is better." Instead of Help! being the album where they experimented a bit with sounds, Rubber Soul gets the credit.

I feel that, because of this, Help! is a bit underrated as a Beatles album.  I'd go as far as to say that it's superior to Rubber Soul.  I think the title track is great, and it is part of the 1 trinity (along with Yesterday and Ticket To Ride, both awesome songs.) Ticket to Ride was one of the first tunes to have a bit of a different sound to it, if I remember correctly.  Then you have a great Lennon tune (You've Got To Hide Your Love Away), songs that are just REALLY REALLY catchy (You're Gonna Lose That Girl, The Night Before - and the latter is so, SO fun to listen to and get into), George starting to be different (I Need You), some very fast singing by Paul (I've Just Seen A Face, which is a really cool song), and another Paul dittie called Another Girl.

It's such a well put-together album, and most of the songs are pretty darn good.  But it never seems to hold up if compared to any later albums.  Heck, if you look at the "What is the best album?" thread, Help! isn't even listed as a contender.  Why is this?

Help usually does get a bad press compared to the other albums. I've always found it a similar album to beatles for sale. The bealtles are bored with the whole beatlemania thing an want to try some newer interesting musical ideas. But they havnt got enough time because of there scheduals to really put some huge effort into the music. Also at the time they were almost permantly stoned which means they wernt in the fittest state for making a album. I've always thought help sounded half baked, like they wanted to try something serious but couldnt quite pull it of, and Rubber Soul was the first album where they truly realised wat they wanted.

But when you look at it i suppose it has got some great songs. I really like tell me what you see, and your gonna loose that girl. Then it has on the hits such as help, ticket to ride, and yesterday. I suppose help isnt as bad as i heard some people say it is, but i still think its only a warm up to rubber soul.

I agree.
Help is a great album.
And you didn't even mention the divine 'It's Only Love'.

i've read that lennon hated that song

Quoted from Frightwolf, posted September 10, 2004, 5:23am at here

songs that are just REALLY REALLY catchy

I think you answered the question yourself. I like the album alot, but the songs still hover around their earlier work in my opinion. Rubber Soul songs have more substance and sound a bit deeper to me. It really doesnt matter though, as long as you like it, thats all that matters.

(it was the first Beatle cd I ever bought)

Quoted from Kiss_My_Bad_Self, posted September 10, 2004, 11:15am at here

i've read that lennon hated that song

That's true. Its originla title was "That's a nice hat", and JOHN always felts it had terrible lyrics, written beacuse they needed another song for the album.

However, I absolutely ADORE this song! I love it. It's divine, as you say.

It's also a song that talks of Lennon's shyness with women.

A lot of people would have loved to have written this song and in any case Lennon was very critical of a lot of his own work.

Quoted from Kiss_My_Bad_Self, posted September 10, 2004, 11:15am at here

i've read that lennon hated that song

Yeah, but he hates most songs he'd written. Except for "Help!" and "Strawberry Fields", I think...

Quoted from tkitna, posted September 10, 2004, 4:17pm at here

I think you answered the question yourself. I like the album alot, but the songs still hover around their earlier work in my opinion. Rubber Soul songs have more substance and sound a bit deeper to me. It really doesnt matter though, as long as you like it, thats all that matters.

(it was the first Beatle cd I ever bought)

And you're right, of course, with your last sentence.  I know that I consider it a great album, and I made this topic strictly for clarification and debate.  It's true that some stuff like You're Gonna Lose That Girl and The Night Before are like early rockers and tunes, but that's the beauty of it.  It has the introspective pieces like Help! and deeper things like Yesterday, but it still has a few of those catchy tunes mixed in and different sounds like Ticket to Ride.

I know you said you liked it, but I'd like to make that point as well.

Quoted from Soft_Guitar60, posted September 10, 2004, 5:33pm at here

Yeah, but he hates most songs he'd written. Except for "Help!" and "Strawberry Fields", I think...

Probably.  During a Lennon tribute by Macca, Paul sang Strawberry Fields Forever, Help!, and Give Peace a Chance, which would definitely be three songs that I think John really liked.

i think lennon hated his songs that didnt really mean much to him, that he mainly wrote for fun, such as dig a pony. but although songs like that arnt really that meaningful i think there still good in there own right.

Help! is probably my least favorite Beatles album.

Quoted from Sadie4, posted September 10, 2004, 5:07pm at here

That's true. Its originla title was "That's a nice hat", and JOHN always felts it had terrible lyrics, written beacuse they needed another song for the album.

However, I absolutely ADORE this song! I love it. It's divine, as you say.

yeah i agree 

Quoted from Kiss_My_Bad_Self, posted September 10, 2004, 10:02pm at here

i think lennon hated his songs that didnt really mean much to him, that he mainly wrote for fun, such as dig a pony. but although songs like that arnt really that meaningful i think there still good in there own right.

i think hated is much too strong a term.  if you go strictly by the bitter RS interview, lennon was disliking just about everything except his new album & yoko.  he'd warmed up considerably by the '80 playboy, where he seemed relatively happy w/ a good chunk of his catalog.

i agree with kiss my bad self, its a warm up to the great rubber soul

  I agree Help! is really a great album and goes unnoticed.  The songs are just as good as those on Rubber Soul but the sound is a bit more stripped.  To me I think the way the songs were mixed to cd gives it a much 'dry' edge.  I think George Martin did a totally new mix for Help! and Rubber Soul in stereo for their cd release. For some reason I dont think the songs on Help! were transfered well on cd.  Thast's my opinon anyway..

You Like Me Too Much is one of my all time favorites! 
And I ADORE Tell Me What You See.





Help is definitely underrated!

I feel Help is still, by any strectch of the imagination..a classic Album.
But when comparing it to other Beatle Albums such as Rubber Soul etc ..The package seems slightly weak.
I see Help as the end of Beatlemania, a firm Winkle stomp, crushing the screaming culture which developed from earlier smash hits like With the Beatles & A Hard Days Night.
With this inevitable end, we also see glimmer of whats to come, which creates a better footing for Help when defending it.
The Dope nature of Help has not fully saturated the mood of the Album (unlike the follow up - Rubber Soul)..but again, the listener can see shades of future mind-sets.

This in itself, makes Help a fascinating listen.

Quoted from Mendips, posted September 30, 2004, 12:03pm at here

I ADORE Tell Me What You See.

I love the way Paul and John blend their voices on this track - "Look in to these eyes now..."

Quoted from IndicaWalrus, posted September 30, 2004, 3:02pm at here

I see Help as the end of Beatlemania.

I've always thought something similar to this. I think help is like the transition album, from Beatlemania to moer psychedelic lyrics. It's like the album that belongs to no period, it's in between changes or something...

I like Help, all the songs are excellent except for the covers.
George's songs are beatiful

You need to bear in mind that the British release's and American release's of albums were WAY different until the magical days of CD's..........

To answer your question, I haven't a clue. Help was never under rated by me, so I don't know what other people think.  Oft times, I don't care what other people think.

I like every song from the Help Soundtrack album.  Every one.  It's a great album! the Beatles never made a 'Bad' album that I've heard.

Quoted from IndicaWalrus, posted September 30, 2004, 3:02pm at here

I feel Help is still, by any strectch of the imagination..a classic Album.
But when comparing it to other Beatle Albums such as Rubber Soul etc ..The package seems slightly weak.
I see Help as the end of Beatlemania, a firm Winkle stomp, crushing the screaming culture which developed from earlier smash hits like With the Beatles & A Hard Days Night.
With this inevitable end, we also see glimmer of whats to come, which creates a better footing for Help when defending it.
The Dope nature of Help has not fully saturated the mood of the Album (unlike the follow up - Rubber Soul)..but again, the listener can see shades of future mind-sets.

I think you are over anylizing the whole thing.

Actually, to be more blunt......I have no Idea what you're talking about.

What song off the HELP album was less than par?

This in itself, makes Help a fascinating listen.

I didnt say less than par*, more of a change in direction, which ultimately meant the sound and attitude would change.
When I used the word Weak* I meant in terms of conceptualism, which only fully emerges around Rubber Soul.

Im not over analysing at all, more looking beyond the attitude of 'its fab', and trying to pull out theories and opinions in why is might be seen as underrated.

I think it is definately underrated, but could have been even better with the inclusion of Yes It Is, I`m Down and Leave My Kitten Alone. And maybe take a couple off which I`m not too keen on   

The fact that this lp was a soundtrack to a movie hurts its credibility! Yea there's awsome songs on it but compared to Beatle lps that were not soundtracks it comes up short! The instrumentals hurt the lp! THere are some excellent songs on this lp! I love the album myself but I don't think it comes to mind when talking about great Beatle lps!

Somewhat underrated, yep ... but it's not the only one!  

Here we go with this 'underated' thing again. Since when was Help! underated?

It's their second great album.

It's overrated.

For me it's a bit overrated too ... one thing I don't like about  the album is that it includes 3 or 4 all-time classics and 3 or 4 all-time forgetable songs ... there's no much balance in the quality ... at a different level more or less the same can be said about their previous one ... but nobody think that one is overrated at all (and, of course, that's a different debate ... already done!  )

Quoted from raxo

Somewhat underrated, yep ... but it's not the only one!  

Quoted from raxo

For me it's a bit overrated too ...

LOL! ... with the first statement I was trying to say that it's underrated ... here! (like some others albums) ... but for me it's not a great one ... its fame comes because of their title song and Yesterday mostly ... without them it's more or less as good/bad as the previous ones ...

My own list (posted somewhere here before):
1. Guys For Sale
2. Abbey Road
3. Let It Be
4. The Guys
5. Please Please Me
6. Revolver
7. Rubber Soul
8. Yellow Submarine
9. Help!
10. Sgt. Peppers Lonely Hearts Club Band
11. Magical Mystery Tour
12. A Hard Days Night
13. With The Guys

I see this thing about saying 'Guys' is catching on. Am I the only one that finds this irritating?

Quoted from BlueMeanie

I see this thing about saying 'Guys' is catching on. Am I the only one that finds this irritating?

Certainly not. Only raxo and Greenapple like it.

Do you really think it's catching on? ... because of threads like these?:
http://dmbeatles.com/forums/b-films/m-1160932280/ ... there are references from the old past too ... we'd got some kind of debate a few weeks ago ... backing to topic: I've been listening to some tracks of the album and (now that you're talking about irritating things):

Tell Me What You See
You Like Me Too Much
Dizzy Miss Lizzy

are annoying ... but they are not the only ones ... too good songs and too bad songs in the album ... I'd like to have That Means A Lot or Wait instead of some of those ... then Rubber Soul wouldn't seem so great ... or it would?

It exists another thread about Help! and Rubber Soul with interesting points of view:
http://dmbeatles.com/forums/b-albums/m-1155121575/

"Help" is an excellent album. And it is sort of underrated.

Quoted from ScareCrow

"Help" is an excellent album. And it is sort of underrated.

Help! is a fantastic album. What's not to like about it?

Help!  is a Great album!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If any other band had put out Help, it would be considered their masterpiece.  Help is only underated because of its relationship to the great albums that followed.  I think the best 6 or 7 tracks hold their own with Revolver/Rubber Soul.  However, it has some filler that keeps it from the 'greatest album' polls.

Welcome, Silby!