Quoted from Sandra

Dude, I'm from California where political correctness has run amok. I bite my tongue on a daily basis. Personally, I think it's just another excuse for people not to have to think for themselves. You know how annoying thinking can be.

What I meant about the American thing was that someone stated something that made it seem like this is an American run site or something. I always thought it was European based. But what do I know. Political correctness is everywhere anyway and I don't really think it started over here btw. If anything, we were probably the last on board. I'm talking about the behavior, not the origin of the term.  

You seem to be annoyed about it yourself. But, Sandra, of course, I didn`t mean your personal PC, I meant the country`s social policy and its extreme PC, which for me sounds ridiculous (compare being polite and tactful). I understand there are a lot of immigrants in the country, but why not just be tactful and civilized in your wording? I know that you have the first amendment but you do have much censorship as well.

The best solo career is PAUL`s!

Paul and Wings  turned a lot of us 70's youngster's onto The Beatles  , his solo career was my gateway back too them .

I think that Paul lost it though in the 2000's. there is just no room for him here hate to say. I love Macca but some things are better left remembered.  MAF might have fit in over in the UK but here I don't think so, even if he wasn't targeting a younger audience.

Quoted from Mr. Mustard

"Whose solo career DO YOU LIKE BEST?"


jj, did you not know that this was the original question?  AGAIN (damn, I hate having to explain things more than once), this is PURELY AN OPINION QUESTION.  Not "Who had the most hits?"  

And I still stand with my original statement.  It's John Lennon's career.  Whatever weak argument you have against that, based on 'chart position,' IS JUST WRONG.  PERIOD.  Nobody really cares about who had the most top 10 hits.  Figure it out already.

So by what you're saying John's career is the best not because of chart position but because YOU think it's the best career? That's ridiculous. What you're saying is only based on your opinion which means absolutely nothing if we're talking about who had the best career as far as best music and sales. Since we're talking about Whose career we all think is best based on opinion then you're just as right as I am because it's only based on our opinion. But you seem to be saying that John's career is the best in all regard because YOU say so. That's just stupid.

Take into account the fact that very often chart position is received due to commercial interests and is determined by showbusiness. Often it has nothing to do with being the best song. Besides, remember that IMAGINE reached only 2 or 3 position at that time but later it was considered to be the best song of the 20th century. How are we to judge? So, tastes differ...

I always thought it was odd "Imagine" was'nt released as a single when the album came out in 1971 .
It was only released here in the UK when "The Shaved Fish" compilation was released in 1975 .
Anyone know why John did'nt release it as a UK single in 1971 ?

Quoted from Jane

You seem to be annoyed about it yourself. But, Sandra, of course, I didn`t mean your personal PC, I meant the country`s social policy and its extreme PC, which for me sounds ridiculous (compare being polite and tactful). I understand there are a lot of immigrants in the country, but why not just be tactful and civilized in your wording? I know that you have the first amendment but you do have much censorship as well.

The best solo career is PAUL`s!

Having to put up with a few PC nuts is not the same as having censorship. If I say something someone considers offensive all I have to deal with is some eye rolling or a heavy sigh. I won't be fined or go to jail for it.

As for the thread. Even if an artist's work didn't do that well originally, or didn't do as well as his fellow artists, doesn't mean that later on, in hindsight, people wouldn't see their work as something more than what they originally thought it was. It could very well be that Lennon's work is far more remembered or revered than Paul's in the long run for reasons beyond chart position and concert sales. Or not.

Quoted from DaveRam

I always thought it was odd "Imagine" was'nt released as a single when the album came out in 1971 .
It was only released here in the UK when "The Shaved Fish" compilation was released in 1975 .
Anyone know why John did'nt release it as a UK single in 1971 ?

There seems to have been a tendency (I wouldn't call it a policy) to keep singles and albums separate in the UK up until about the early to mid seventies. "Mother " and "Woman Is the black person Of The World" were also album tracks that were US but not UK singles. About half of The Beatles' UK singles weren't included on their original sixties albums, and only "Something / Come Together" was taken from an already issued album (but "A Hard Day's Night" and "Eleanor Rigby / Yellow Submarine" were issued simultaneously with albums, though - I think  ).

Or think of The Rolling Stones' Decca singles: none of the A sides were issued on UK albums (unless "In Another Land" and "She's A Rainbow" were released as singles in England as well as America), and only two B sides were.

As late as 1973 Paul was opposed to putting "Helen Wheels" -already issued as single - on Band On The Run, but he agreed to Al Coury's suggestion that it be included on the American version of the album.

Quoted from Wordno

So by what you're saying John's career is the best not because of chart position but because YOU think it's the best career? That's ridiculous. What you're saying is only based on your opinion which means absolutely nothing if we're talking about who had the best career as far as best music and sales. Since we're talking about Whose career we all think is best based on opinion then you're just as right as I am because it's only based on our opinion. But you seem to be saying that John's career is the best in all regard because YOU say so. That's just stupid.

Wordno, do I now have to explain this to you?  Apparently I do.

The question (HERE I GO AGAIN) was 'whose career is your favorite?'  

And my answer was, and continues to be..... (DRUMROLL).... John's.  My opinion.  YES. MY OPINION.  THAT'S ALL IT IS.

Not "who had the best sales, or most hits, or biggest concerts."  That's not the question.  It was 'who is your favorite?'  Period.

If the original question had been, "Which ex-Beatle had the most hits, sold the most records and had the biggest tours?," then YES, the answer would be PAUL!  No one is disputing that!  Quit feeling threatened that someone prefers John's music!  (By the way, here's more bad news for you:  All Things Must Pass is better than any Paul album, and frankly I prefer My Sweet Lord to any solo Beatle recording -- no matter what the Chiffons think.  Any John fan who doesn't like that, bring it on!)

And yes, Wordno, this is ONLY my opinion.  But here's something that might shock ya:  your opinion is worth just as much as mine.  If you're a Paul fan, I understand why.  I'm not trying to convince anyone to change their preferences to mine.  But when I hear that my preferences are incorrect due to chart positions and record sales.... no.  Anyone who makes that argument is wrong, and probably doesn't have a very good taste in music, or art, if everything they like is based on 'what the crowd likes.'

According to 'chart positions,' George Bush handily won the 2004 election.  I don't think I was wrong to have voted against him.  (And I don't even want to talk about the 2000 election.)

Quoted from Mr. Mustard

  (By the way, here's more bad news for you:  All Things Must Pass is better than any Paul album, and frankly I prefer My Sweet Lord to any solo Beatle recording -- no matter what the Chiffons think.  Any John fan who doesn't like that, bring it on!)

There you go, you proved my point. What exactly makes All Things Must Pass better than any Paul album? Because you said so? I understand what your answer is and what the topic is about. Read my previous post again. What I was saying is that you're saying John's solo career IS better than Paul's career and now you're saying All Things Must Pass IS better than any Paul album because YOU say so. That to me is stupid. You go on and on with your condescending way of speaking to other people about how this is an opinion topic and we all have equal say and yet you stuff your opinion as fact down our throats. Heh what a joke.

Quoted from Geoff

There seems to have been a tendency (I wouldn't call it a policy) to keep singles and albums separate in the UK up until about the early to mid seventies. "Mother " and "Woman Is the black person Of The World" were also album tracks that were US but not UK singles. About half of The Beatles' UK singles weren't included on their original sixties albums, and only "Something / Come Together" was taken from an already issued album (but "A Hard Day's Night" and "Eleanor Rigby / Yellow Submarine" were issued simultaneously with albums, though - I think  ).

Or think of The Rolling Stones' Decca singles: none of the A sides were issued on UK albums (unless "In Another Land" and "She's A Rainbow" were released as singles in England as well as America), and only two B sides were.

As late as 1973 Paul was opposed to putting "Helen Wheels" -already issued as single - on Band On The Run, but he agreed to Al Coury's suggestion that it be included on the American version of the album.

Maybe John Still had that Beatles policy in his mind not to release singles from albums and thats why it was'nt originaly released as a single in the UK Geoff .
Prior to John's murder it was'nt a particular big song in the UK , people admired it , but after his death it took on a whole new life becoming the monster classic it is now .
As a song i think it's ok but i much prefer # 9 Dream , i've always thought thats his best song .
And i think Paul was stupid not to have  "Helen Wheels " on  Band On The Run in the UK , the song references the album .

Quoted from Wordno

There you go, you proved my point. What exactly makes All Things Must Pass better than any Paul album? Because you said so? I understand what your answer is and what the topic is about. Read my previous post again. What I was saying is that you're saying John's solo career IS better than Paul's career and now you're saying All Things Must Pass IS better than any Paul album because YOU say so. That to me is stupid. You go on and on with your condescending way of speaking to other people about how this is an opinion topic and we all have equal say and yet you stuff your opinion as fact down our throats. Heh what a joke.

Dude.  The only thing I've proven is that you can't figure out what I'm talking about.  

Here it is AGAIN:  

I DO NOT CLAIM THAT MY MUSICAL PREFERENCES ARE BETTER THAN YOURS.

I'm only stating MY OWN PREFERENCES.  THAT'S IT.

Not one time did I say that "John's career is the best because I say so."  If you like Paul or George or Ringo's better, then FINE!  I'm not going to tell you that you're wrong.  But for my ears, it's John.  He's the best.

YOU DO NOT HAVE TO AGREE WITH THAT.  I DON'T CARE EITHER WAY.

Figure that out already!  I said in my last post that my opinion is no more valid than yours or anyone else's.  But my opinion is not changing.  If Paul is your guy, FINE.  I have no problem with that. I dig his stuff too.  Just not as much as John's.   So get over it and don't expect me to jump on your bandwagon.  I never said I was right and everyone else was wrong.

Figure it out dude.

Quoted from Mr. Mustard

"Whose solo career DO YOU LIKE BEST?"


jj, did you not know that this was the original question?  AGAIN (damn, I hate having to explain things more than once), this is PURELY AN OPINION QUESTION.  Not "Who had the most hits?"  

And I still stand with my original statement.  It's John Lennon's career.  Whatever weak argument you have against that, based on 'chart position,' IS JUST WRONG.  PERIOD.  Nobody really cares about who had the most top 10 hits.  Figure it out already.

"Whose solo career do you like best" ranks right up there with "Who had the best hair".  At the top of my page, it says "Best Solo Career" which is what I answered.

Of course chart positions and hits don't matter to you! John didn't have them! If he did, they WOULD matter to you! LOL!

John wrote songs FEWER PEOPLE WERE INTERESTED IN LISTENING TO.  He lost MOST of his Beatle's audience, and at least ONE of his major releases was percieved by THE PUBLIC as being so bad, it sold less than 90,000 copies and didn't even crack the top 40.

If basing Paul's solo career on "chart positions" is just "WRONG, PERIOD", then base John's solo career on the fact that MOST FANS DIDN'T LIKE THE MUSIC he was putting out.  What the hell do you base "best" on?

If people don't like what an artist is SELLING, it's hard to consider his career BEST. And if it's your OPINION that one artist who writes music FAR FEWER PEOPLE WANT TO HEAR, who can't attract people to shows, and who DROPS OUT in the middle has a "better" career than another one who can attract people to shows, and get them into record stores, and doesn't DROP OUT IN THE MIDDLE of his career, then you are just plain D E L U D E D.

LOL.


Yeah... In my opinion Captain Beefheart has a better career than Fleetwood Mac... Makes sense.

Quoted from Jane

Take into account the fact that very often chart position is received due to commercial interests and is determined by showbusiness. Often it has nothing to do with being the best song. Besides, remember that IMAGINE reached only 2 or 3 position at that time but later it was considered to be the best song of the 20th century. How are we to judge? So, tastes differ...

"Commerical" interest is still... interest.  

"Chart positions" aren't really relevant... but sales figures are. What's the difference if a song hits #1 for a week or stays at #2 for 6 months? What is relevant is "How many people out there are going to like the song I just wrote, or is it so boring (or same old same old) that are they just going to ignore it?" and "Now that I wrote a song millions of people liked enough to buy, can I do it again and again?"

One of the first things I said was that John's songs did not meet with much success without help. "Imagine" was certainly helped by his death. Going down the posthumous road won't lead anywhere good.

Quoted from Mr. Mustard

I DO NOT CLAIM THAT MY MUSICAL PREFERENCES ARE BETTER THAN YOURS.

I'm only stating MY OWN PREFERENCES.  THAT'S IT.

Not one time did I say that "John's career is the best because I say so."  

Actually, when you started enumerating songs as if that was supposed to mean something, you did just that.