Quoted from BlueMeanie

And for the record, what exactly does Ringo have to apologise for??

I never thought Ringo should apologize to Pete. He should have gotten down on his hands and knees and kissed Pete's boots for Pete's less than stellar (i.e. "Starr-key") drumming.  

That's a joke, ya'll.  Ringo has this weird loopiness, groove thing that Pete never really had.  Pete banged away sorta like a Punk drummer.  Ringo was more supple, but still forceful.  I can't imagine Pete having the subtlety to play "And I Love Her."

Quoted from adamzero

I never thought Ringo should apologize to Pete. He should have gotten down on his hands and knees and kissed Pete's boots for Pete's less than stellar (i.e. "Starr-key") drumming.  

That's a joke, ya'll.  Ringo has this weird loopiness, groove thing that Pete never really had.  Pete banged away sorta like a Punk drummer.  Ringo was more supple, but still forceful.  I can't imagine Pete having the subtlety to play "And I Love Her."

Ringo's style of drumming was fairly unique. Pete Best was just an average thumper.

No

Interesting discussion, folks! Here's my two cents:

Quoted from Loco Mo

Should Ringo have tipped Pete off that the boys had asked him to join?

If we're going to blame unaffiliated drummers for not ratting the Beatles out, then Johnny Hutchinson of the Big Three deserves his share of the blame. I can't remember which biography I read this in, but at least one documenter says that the Beatles went to Hutchinson first. Hutchinson turned them down, because he was good friends with Pete and he liked the group he was in already. The Beatles supposedly went to Ringo next.

But my personal opinion is that neither Johnny (if this story is true) nor Ringo owed Pete an explanation or a tip. This was an internal matter to the Beatles. It was up to the band to handle their own affairs. I think the real problem is that the Beatles were very young, and simply didn't know how to handle such a ticklish situation. John Lennon said somewhere that he was afraid that any face-to-face confrontation would have ended in blows. This is the level of sophistication we are talking about; young punks from Liverpool. They weren't exactly sensitive New Age men. So they chickened out and made Brian do it.

From what I understand, George was the most keen to replace Pete. Yes, Pete did miss several gigs, but Paul missed a lot more (or was late) because he had to take care of his brother. The real issue was that Pete's style of drumming didn't mesh well with the front line. I know this is a matter of opinion and taste, but in this case, I agree with George Martin. Pete sounds like he has a good dance hall band style-- very loud! But Ringo tailored his drumming for the song. Since that was Georgia's style as well, I can see why George preferred Ringo as a drummer. Also, these boys wanted to get a record made, but on their terms. I can see why they didn't want to have a different sound on their records (for example, if a session man was used) than when they played live. They would feel it was dishonest. I'm not sure how well that would've worked for band relations either, if the others were recording but Pete was only playing their live gigs.

Quoted Text

Did Ringo really have to make the remark that "he took little pills to make him ill?"

When I read this quote in the February 1965 Playboy Interview, it was fairly clear to me that Ringo was just joking around. They were quite silly through this whole interview. I'll include that snippet of dialogue, and you can form your own opinions:

PLAYBOY: "Let's start over. Ringo, you're the last Beatle to join the group, aren't you?"

RINGO: "Yes."

JOHN: "A few years probably... sort of off and on, really... for three years or so."

PAUL: "Yeah, but really amateur."

GEORGE: "The local pub, you know. And in each other's uncle's houses."

JOHN: "And at George's brother's wedding. Things like that. Ringo used to fill in sometimes if our drummer was ill. With his periodic illness."

RINGO: "He took little pills to make him ill."

PLAYBOY: "When you joined the others Ringo, they weren't quite as big as they are now, were they?"

RINGO: "They were the biggest thing in Liverpool. In them days that was big enough."

Lets not forget that Ringo only joined the Beatles because they offered him 25 pounds instead of the 20 pounds that Kingsize Taylor was going to offer him. That being said, Ringo wasnt begging to become a Beatle, he went where there was more money.

Excellent point, Tkitna. It was a business proposition. Ringo could make BIG BUCKS-- 25 a week! Luxury in those days. He liked the Beatles, but he wasn't shopping around. He had a steady gig with Rory.

Quoted from harihead

Excellent point, [...]He liked the Beatles, [...]

Better point, harihead ... and apart from the fact that he liked them, they had already got a recording contract in London waiting for them ... they could "kill for that piece of plastic" called by that time "record" ... apart from that they were the most famous band in Liverpool ... 5 more pounds for who knows how long seems to be a too little difference to left a "steady gig".

Yes, excellent point, Raxo. Ringo was wounded forever when he got to the studio and Martin didn't want him to play. I think opportunity to record was like a gift falling from the sky to him.

Quoted from raxo

Better point, harihead ...

He didnt like them enough that he was going to turn down the money. If KT offered the extra 5, I guarantee you that Ringo Starr would have never of been a Beatle.

Quoted from tkitna

He didnt like them enough that he was going to turn down the money. If KT offered the extra 5, I guarantee you that Ringo Starr would have never of been a Beatle.

I have to believe you, if you can guarantee it!

You dont have to believe me, but you would be wrong if you didnt.  

Quoted from tkitna

You dont have to believe me, but you would be wrong if you didnt.  

I know, I know ... so, I'll do ...

Quoted from tkitna

He didnt like them enough that he was going to turn down the money. If KT offered the extra 5, I guarantee you that Ringo Starr would have never of been a Beatle.

OooOOooOOohhhh.....   You just made my brain go all screwy. *wobbles off into the corner and sits down hard*

I have to say, the drummer is the easiest thing to see changing on the Beatles-- but it sure is hard to envision what the dynamics of the group would be if that were the case. *quickly plays movie Hard Day's Night to restore the past as we know it*

I can't stop thinking about Jimmy Nicol. I know it was only a couple of weeks or whatever, but the press conferences were just as witty, the concerts just as hysterical. If Ringo (God forbid) had died on that operatting table and Jimmy had stayed, what really would have changed?

Quoted from Kevin

I can't stop thinking about Jimmy Nicol. I know it was only a couple of weeks or whatever, but the press conferences were just as witty, the concerts just as hysterical. If Ringo (God forbid) had died on that operatting table and Jimmy had stayed, what really would have changed?

Do you know what Jimmy could do as well as you know what Ringo could? Because I don't! ... maybe tkitna!