Quoted from Kevin

That's a very bold statement. Can you support that with anything? Evidence please of this remarkable change of heart by Mr Lennon.
A double album with Phil Spector producing,  5 months in the making and it wasn't intended to impress?
Damned if I can find them now, but I have read many a time that John had intended STINYC to be exactly that: his masterpiece.
From Wiki (again):," Lennon was devastated at its commercial failure and would not record any music for almost an entire year."
And Yoko's recent revelation that John used to lay awake sleepless at night because he couldn't write hit songs like Paul anymore?
And read these interviews from John in 1971: http://www.instantkarma.com/balladjohnmintz.html
It is obvious that poltics has consumed John. Read these and tell me that John didn't intend STINYC to be a major statement.

John was wrong about it then. As daft as the next fella. I'm sorry for you that he wasn't the 'God' you thought he was.

Quoted from 724

John was wrong about it then.

But I'm asking how you know this, because it's quite a revelation.
It's that "why" part of me that you don't understand at work again.

Quoted from Kevin

But I'm asking how you know this, because it's quite a revelation.
It's that "why" part of me that you don't understand at work again.

Because you seem to think it was meant to be a masterpiece, whereas with hindsight it wasn't. How can I not understand the "why" part Kevin?

Quoted from 724

Because you seem to think it was meant to be a masterpiece, whereas with hindsight it wasn't. How can I not understand the "why" part Kevin?

I was referring to out other conversation in the book department. Sorry - it was how, not why. Was supposed to be a joke.
Back to STINYC - R Carr in his book said John intended the album to be his definitive statement.
Wiki says he was devasted by its failure.
Everything I've ever read about Lennon has indicated that he cared deeply about the success of his work. I'm asking how it is you know that John didn't consider this to be a masterpiece to stand alongside POB and Imagine, because it goes against everything I've read. (the fact that it wasn't a masterpiece isn't really the issue)
You must have a quote, or read something. Anything. I'm not looking for a fight - I want to know

Just food for thought, but here's some Lennon quotes:
1971 Interview with Ali and Black:
"that's why I'm putting out more heavy statements now and trying to shake off the teeny-bopper image.
I want to get through to the right people, and I want to make what I have to say very simple and direct."
Hardly the words of a man who'd said all he had to say.

1972 Interview with Hit Parader:
Q: "Are you now remotely interested in singles or chart success?"
JOHN: "Sure. I get all the musical papers and the daily papers. I get my world chart thing and Billboard, and the other one... . I get a kick out of it because I'm getting through to all those people, and because I'm doing it on my own or with Yoko."
After Imagine.

1975, RollingStone, when talking about how politics affected his career (he confesses it almost destroyed it)
Q: "How did all of this affect your work?"
JOHN: "It almost ruined it, in a way. It became journalism and not poetry. And I basically feel that I'm a poet. Even if it does go ba-deeble, eedle, eedle, it, da-deedle, deedle, it. I'm not a formalized poet, I have no education, so I have to write in the simplest forms usually. And I realized that over a period of time - and not just 'cause I met Jerry Rubin off the plane - but that was like a culmination. I realized that we were poets but we were really folk poets, and rock & roll was folk poetry - I've always felt that. Rock & roll was folk music. Then I began to take it seriously on another level, saying, "Well, I am reflecting what is going on, right?" And then I was making an effort to reflect what was going on. Well, it doesn't work like that. It doesn't work as pop music or what I want to do. It just doesn't make sense."

John was wrong about the album and that period, whatever he intended it to be it wasn't. There's something in Skywriting about him saying it was the most regretable period of his career. Maybe I was wrong? He did intend for it to have a huge impact. It didn't. Still better than Rock 'N' Roll.

Cool. Are we agreeing now. Everone accepts that STINYC was  a big mistake and that Lennon really regretted it. It was your comment that John was "over the music business" after Imagine that threw me.

The solo careers would never match what they did together. They'd all shot their classics after their first solo albums. They still made great music but they we're singing about the same ideals and ideas, McCartney and Ringo still play the same tricks. There is nothing new in what they do after '71. Together they discovered and they continued to discover into the next decades, it's just that they were aware of what they were doing. I think John tried something new with SINYC, didn't work. Not in the mainstream commercial sense at least. None of the others tried to make such a bold statement with an album, still his whole political plans didn't work.  But if they'd have done the tour who knows?

Sometimes In New York City is a remarkably bad album, especially following on from Imagine.

Quoted from maninthequeue

Sometimes In New York City is a remarkably bad album, especially following on from Imagine.

Yes i agree that it was a bad follow up to such a masterpiece!

I watched the Imagine film last night (part of Beatles week on Danish telly), and I have to say, although good it's hardly the masterpiece that everyone seems to think I like it more than STINYC, but I don't think it's that much better. I find STINYC very underrated. It's worth another listen.

I'm going to say Walls & Bridges is John's worst album, because it's mediocre for the most part & his creativity is taking a nose dive with only a few good tracks.  

I don't have SNINYC or Double Fantasy, but always thought about the former as his worst album, and the latter as his best after Plastic Ono Band and Imagine. It's incredible that many consider it as his worst album. How can made a piece of crap of his first album in 5 years!!? He wouldn't make something better? C'mon! I never heard the album, but I think it has to be great, the 3 singles (and Beautiful Boy) are really good songs.

Quoted from wingsman

I don't have SNINYC or Double Fantasy, but always thought about the former as his worst album, and the latter as his best after Plastic Ono Band and Imagine. It's incredible that many consider it as his worst album. How can made a piece of crap of his first album in 5 years!!? He wouldn't make something better? C'mon! I never heard the album, but I think it has to be great, the 3 singles (and Beautiful Boy) are really good songs.

How can you comment on an album that you haven't heard? You must be one of the 'Lennon Is God' brigade - 'It can't possibly be bad, it's John Lennon'!!! Have you even heard STINTC? Or are you basing your opinions on rumour?

Please Blue Meanie, don't misunderstand me! As I said, it's hard to believe that Double Fantasy is his worst album EVER considering this tips:
1) it was largely written and recorded. His first studio album of original material in 6 years, in a new phase of his life, with a child growing, an established marriage, a father & husband life, not a celebrity life.
2) it received a Grammy for Album of the Year, the only time he received that award (I know the murderer was decisive, but anyway can't possible be so bad anyway)
3) as I said the 3 singles released from the album are fantastic songs, also I know Beautiful Boy and Oh Yoko and I think those are great songs
4) and I'm talking thinking of the proffesional reviews I've read

I did not listen any of both albums, I'm just giving my opinion since what I've read basically.

And I'm telling you that I'm not one of the 'Lennon is God' brigade (brigade!, that's funny). To me, Lennon is not God, but McCartney has been doin' it all so well in the past 50 years that he's really going to deserve that credit.

And, as always, sorry my english guys!