Bet this starts an argument:

McCartney urges vegetarianism to fight climate ills
Mon Apr 21, 2008 12:01am EDT

NEW YORK, April 21 (Reuters) - Former Beatle Paul McCartney is urging the world to go vegetarian in a bid to fight global warming and is surprised more green groups don't promote it.

In an interview with the animal rights group People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA), McCartney said the global meat industry was a major contributor to global warming. A transcript of the PETA interview was given to Reuters.

"The biggest change anyone could make in their own lifestyle would be to become vegetarian," McCartney, a longtime vegetarian and advocate of vegetarianism, said. "I would urge everyone to think about taking this simple step to help our precious environment and save it for the children of the future."

McCartney says the amount of land and water used to maintain the meat industry makes it a major contributor to climate change and complains that most environmental groups do not list vegetarianism as one of their top priorities.

"It's very surprising that most major environmental organizations are leaving the option of going vegetarian off their lists of top ways to curtail global warming," he said.

A 2006 United Nations report found that cattle-rearing generated more greenhouse gases than transportation.

http://www.reuters.com/article/latestCrisis/idUSN18449776

Meanwhile, the development of bio-fuels are gradually driving the price of simple foods higher and higher. How can we ever win?

Great topic, Geoff. I'm not sure if it belongs in the Paul forum, though, or in "Different Conversations", since it's sort of enviromental/political. (awaits instructions)

First, everyone should read James Howard Kunstler's excellent and brilliantly written books: "The Long Emergency: Surviving the Converging Catastrophes of the Twenty-First Century" and, if you're up for more, "Home from Nowhere" or any other urban-planning book of his you can pick up. He addresses the bio-fuel issue Klang brings up and many others, all written in a delightful style. I have become a JHK groupie and can't wait for his new book to come out.

Then, read Barbara Kingsolver's book "Animal, Vegetable, Miracle" (which I haven't finished, by the way) where her family attempts to eat only locally grown food for an entire year. She discovered that there is a reason you have animals on farms. They serve a vital purpose, and strict vegetarianism really is sort of an artifact of our oil-fueled, factory-farming approach to food production.

This is where Sir Paul just doesn't know. He probably understands all the good reasons to give a big thumbs down to factory farming (any number of books cover this well). What's a little trickier is understanding how people can live sustainably in a natural environment, which we are so far removed from that most of us don't even have a clue how it works. Probably 98% of us wouldn't know an organic farm if we fell across it.

So, anyway, a possible answer to Paul's question why "most major environmental organizations are leaving the option of going vegetarian off their lists of top ways to curtail global warming" could be because they understand that pure veggie doesn't work in a sustainable format, but it's a fiendishly difficult subject to address so they don't even try. Besides, who wants to eat cute little lambs and bunnies? Bunch of hard-hearted jerks we are. But we'll have to recover or reinvent those skills on a widespread basis when our current system of exploitive farming (which has depleted most of the topsoil on the planet) becomes unviable.

I don't eat veggies or fruits, so I have no idea what i would eat if I stopped eating meat.

a life without meat is a life that's incomplete. sorry paul- never going to happen

I think asking people to change at the drop of a hat. or expecting them to just because it's going to help the planet is not going to change people's eating habits.
I eat meat, I try to eat more veggies for healths sake but do we see how much we are hearing in America about being overweight. People aren't helping that situation so unless people open their eyes to what's going on I don't think one man is going to change it.

im not to worried about becoming overweight, but thats because im 2pounds from being underweight

well I guess what I'm saying is people aren't going to change so easily.

im bad at changing cause im a super stubborn person and i know it

same here

hehe and im a  pessimist most of the time. YOULL NEVER CHANGE MY MIND! I HATE SPINACH!

I think McCartney is a bit naive on these issues. He should just stick to making music. The so called political thing is a bit beyond him I think.

When you grow up eating meat it is extremely hard to just stop.  Besides, like you said Sandra, sounds like he doesn't have all the facts and is a bit naive.  
I honestly would love to be a vegetarian, it's just so hard. I have cut back quite a bit though.  And to be honest, my choice to do so had nothing to do with the environment.  It was mostly for health reasons and I really do feel like this day in age, we do not need to have animal meat to survive. Not like centuries ago when you had to. Nowadays we can supplement our diets to get protein.

Like many celebrities he has been misled by PETA and their ilk and not given all of the information. I think vegetarianism is fine as long as you're not militant about it.

I went veggie about six months ago after being an avid meat eater. If you go for the right things it's not so hard at all. They're making great meat substitutes that you can get at the local grocer's. Everything from tofu and veggie based hot dogs and sausages, burgers that taste just like beef, pork, or chicken, etc. I even get 'ribs' in a great BBQ sauce. This stuff really tastes like it's intended to, no kidding. I'm not pushing this on anyone, but I ask you to make your own test some time. I'll bet you'll be surprised.

Why would I do this? My lovely new wife wouldn't marry anyone who eats anything that once had a face.

Motivation.

but isn't that cheating?? if it tastes like meat?

I was a vegetarian for 15 years (or so). I found the switchover quite easy, and I didn't miss meat at all. But I had an informed vegetarian directing me how to do it, so I could combine the right foods to give myself the amino acids that you normally get from eating flesh.

What happened to me was, after a period of excellent health lasting about 12 years, my iron count started dropping and nothing could turn it around: diet, supplements, whatever. My body just decided it wasn't able to make iron for whatever reason. My doctor finally said, "You have to eat meat!" So I did. I bought a steak; it was like taking a pill. I did NOT like it (although the cat went crazy-- he hadn't seen meat in the house for years!). It tasted bad, burned, not like food at all. Yuk.

But the next day I had a huge surge of energy. In other words, I really did need the meat. So I now mix meat into my food, because I need to.

People vary on their ability to absorb things. We are quite different internally. I cannot handle a diet low in fruits and veggies-- it actually hurts me. Other people seem to get by with eating almost no fiber. But there's no one right way to eat. You should do what's best for your health and personal digestion. We all need protein, but how much is a matter of debate. Some people advocate heaps of it; others not so much. I think we're down to personal variation again.

That said, Americans (anyway) eat far too much crap that is bad for them. It's hard to justify how junk food is doing anybody any good. A lot of dietary choices are made because it's simply what's available. You go to the drive through because it's there. I can't imagine why you would seek out this hideous plasticized food for any other reason.

Quoted from Sgt. Pepper 45822

but isn't that cheating?? if it tastes like meat?

Why so? If it satisfies a craving and keeps one from straying then it's all good in my book.

And yes, mineral absorption is an issue. The liquefied colloidal stuff works best. Ultimately, we must do what we must. As I suggested, the Missus and I do this for ethical reasons. If it gets down to health and survival then I'll take a bite out of someone.

true love.
I admire it

I eat better. I just went for a 1 mile run

I've been veggie for some years now. i coundn't stand the fact that animals were killed for no
reason & it always upset me, but when i did eat eat meat which i must have been about 7-8, i
for some reason got ill. i've always hated the smell of meat cooking. i've always thought that being
vegetarian is very healthy as well! i'm not up on all this climate change, so i i don't know a lot on that.
anyone got macca's e-mail?? haha!  

Why are humans the only carnivores expected to give up meat?

my thoughts exactly.
they don't cut back at the Zoo, so why just because there are more of us should WE cut back.
not that watching the AMOUNT of meat you eat could help but totally doing away with it...it would be up to you.

Quoted from Klang

Why so? If it satisfies a craving and keeps one from straying then it's all good in my book.

And yes, mineral absorption is an issue. The liquefied colloidal stuff works best. Ultimately, we must do what we must. As I suggested, the Missus and I do this for ethical reasons. If it gets down to health and survival then I'll take a bite out of someone.

I guess I just thought you had to consume nothing like meat at all, but I tend to go from one extreme to the other, so I was just asking.

Funny Paul did'nt discuss his massive carbon footprint and the impact all those plane's trucks and fans have made over the years going to his concerts, and the energy used pressing  his records ,his activities with regard to climate change have been massive over the years . In one tour he will maybe fly more than i will do in my life time.
I don't eat a lot of meat and quite like a lot of vegetarian food and i can see a bit of logic in what he's saying , but if we all went veggie millions and millions and millions of farm animals would have to be killed and burned which kind of knocks his suggestion on the head ?
So i think slowly reducing meat intake over many years would be better , along with a managed reduction of livestock , you can't have a big bang approch to such matters , it's a complicated matter . Sorry but i think your been a bit simplistic Paul , but do enjoy your veggie saussage nextime your jetting around the world .

Quoted from Sgt. Pepper 45822

I guess I just thought you had to consume nothing like meat at all, but I tend to go from one extreme to the other, so I was just asking.

Sure, I understand, and it's a logical question. I don't push this on anyone, but I'm pointing out that it's not so difficult a transition to make if you'd care to do so. There are some great substitutes out there.

Quoted from Sgt. Pepper 45822

but isn't that cheating?? if it tastes like meat?

It is not, but it makes no sense. If you feel like to eat meat, why don't you eat REAL meat then??  


I dont support vegetarianism at all, people are omnivorous, that's how our body is made, that's how out teeth are structured. We need meet. Plus, you cant 100%ly substitute all the protein, iron, etc. that meat contains.

I just think it's funny how people contradict themselves. For instance Paul, I'm sorry but think about all the energy you use, all the meat you DID once in your life consume. And now tell people that going veggie is the best, and that it will reduce the harm to our planet. Everyone wants to do their part but on the other hand they also contribute or did contribute to the problem.

Quoted from Taxgirl

I dont support vegetarianism at all, people are omnivorous, that's how our body is made, that's how out teeth are structured. We need meet. Plus, you cant 100%ly substitute all the protein, iron, etc. that meat contains.

My girlfriend is of the Jain religion, who do not consume meat because of the violent death it causes to be inflicted on  animals. Her older relatives won't eat in the evening because insects are active and likely to be consumed (this is for the insects sake, not theirs.) Ditto they won't eat root vegetables because it is more likely to contain life from the soil.
There are millions of Janes, who have been practising this for at least a thousand years before the birth of christ. They seem to live as long and as happily as you and I.
Surely if people want to make a difference that's a good thing. Sure it might involve a little hypocracy, but that's no reason not to try. I eat meat, but all the power to those who don't.
My girlfriend can't understand how one moment I can say "look at the cute lamby wambies" and then tuck in to a nice roast lamb. I blame God and Jesus - the bible gives us carte blanche to slaughter our way through the animal world. Her view of life is vastly different (and in the end I have to admit better. Even if she does pray to some blue dude and an elephant.)

Quoted from Sandra

Why are humans the only carnivores expected to give up meat?

Because we're the only canivores blessed with reason and compassion?

Quoted from Kevin

Because we're the only canivores blessed with reason and compassion?

And we're the only one's capable of deciding what we want to eat, rather than what's available. We can grow vegetables in big fields on farms, and decide where those farms are going to be, and what they're growing. We eat partly for pleasure, and we're unique in that.

I'm OK if someone wants to be a vegetarian, as long as it's not pushed on me (I was one for 2 years). What gets me is people who spout on about vegetarianism, and at the same time walk around in leather shoes, and still eat fish (like it isn't an animal!!).

Anyway, Paul usually comes over as naive when he decides to take issue with something. People should stick to what they know best.

Quoted from Kevin

Because we're the only canivores blessed with reason and compassion?

I had a feeling someone was going to say something like that. But still: free will. And just because people eat animals doesn't mean they're not compassionate. I wish people would show as much passion and outrage towards all the children out there who are being abused and neglected. I swear, I don't see as much fire in people about their own species. I can tell you story after story that would horrify you involving children and how impossible it was to get anyone to help them. And I when I say horror story, I'm not exaggerating. You wear a fur coat though, and you get people throwing blood in your face. The masses come out in droves. I love animals, but really, it's natural to eat animals. Sorry.