Hey, why do we have to have marriage in the fist place. It's an archaic ritual. Yes, there's legal stuff to be considered, but everyone has a right to that. Anyway, it's an outdated social convention. You can LOVE a person and be COMMITTED to a person without having a piece of paper to prove it. Again, financial things are different and of course should be taken care of anyway. There are ways to do this.
And to have government approval is great and all, but really, if your family and friends acknowledge your life style and who you choose to love, then that's what's most important. My government could kiss my a** otherwise. They're wrong about so much anyway that I don't put a whole lot of stock in what they choose to accept and not to accept. People have the freedom to live as they choose anyway. Legalities are never going to be perfect. We are moving forward though and that's what's important.
But yes, I understand that it's a right people want. Must be married. Must be like everyone else.
I know I'm not expressing this correctly, but oh well.
remember, a government that gets to involved inevidably farks things up for the rest of us and makes it worse than it was. example: public education (at least in MA)
"if asking, begging and pleading doesn't work, always go with a song and dance number."
as for jesus and whatnot, even though i'm buddhist now, i was catholic not long ago so i still know my religious crap. If anyone ever tells you that Jesus said it was wrong for whoever to be with whoever, counter with, "jesus said to love thy neighbor, why won't you love me" and then proceed to walk into a gay, muslim bar
"if asking, begging and pleading doesn't work, always go with a song and dance number."
Yes, i'm homophobic. My opinion on the matter is that its just not natural for two men or two women to be together. The bible states it also and thats enough for me.
I knew somebody once that actually came out and told me they were gay in my own home. He was asked to leave and to never come back, never call, and to never have contact with my children again and he hasent. I dont want my children around that especially in my home. Its bad enough that society pressures everybody into accepting it (along with it being ok to not believe in God), when in truth, they should be pushing for people to get to church. The lack of religion is why the worlds tunring to crap in my opinion.
Yes, i'm homophobic. My opinion on the matter is that its just not natural for two men or two women to be together. The bible states it also and thats enough for me.
Homosexual people are born homosexual. There's no artificial process that makes them that way. So homosexuality is not unnatural. And even if it would be unnatural: so frickin what? Everything we do now that we didn't do 1000 years ago is unnatural. There's nothing natural about driving a car. There's nothing natural about staring at a computer screen every day from 9 to 5. There's nothing natural about wearing a suit and tie.
I knew somebody once that actually came out and told me they were gay in my own home. He was asked to leave and to never come back, never call, and to never have contact with my children again and he hasent.
Wow, I think that's just shocking... I really do. Homophobia is a form of discrimination and this is, in my book, a very serious case of discrimination. That's an extremely offensive, insulting thing to do to another human being.
I dont want my children around that especially in my home.
You know homosexuality isn't contagious, right? Of course you're free to raise your children the way you think is right, but what good is sticking your head in the sand ever going to do?
The lack of religion is why the worlds tunring to crap in my opinion.
The towers didn't fall because of a lack of religion. Quite the contrary actually. And I don't think you can say that things were that much better in the Middle Ages, when the church was in charge.
Homosexual people are born homosexual. There's no artificial process that makes them that way. So homosexuality is not unnatural. And even if it would be unnatural: so frickin what? Everything we do now that we didn't do 1000 years ago is unnatural. There's nothing natural about driving a car. There's nothing natural about staring at a computer screen every day from 9 to 5. There's nothing natural about wearing a suit and tie.
You'll need to take your beliefs up with God.
Leviticus 18:22 - Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.
Pretty much states its unnatural right there.
Quoted Text
Wow, I think that's just shocking... I really do. Homophobia is a form of discrimination and this is, in my book, a very serious case of discrimination. That's an extremely offensive, insulting thing to do to another human being.
Well, if discrimination is trying to protect my children from a certain behavior that is not normal, so be it.
Quoted Text
You know homosexuality isn't contagious, right? Of course you're free to raise your children the way you think is right, but what good is sticking your head in the sand ever going to do?
Nothings contagious if you stay far enough away from it.
Quoted Text
So if people don't believe in God, they should be forced to?
Force is a strong word. People that dont believe will be judged soon enough.
Quoted Text
The towers didn't fall because of a lack of religion. Quite the contrary actually.
More political than anything in my opinion. I'm no Muslim expert, but unless somebody can scan where the Quran (sp?) stated that Americans were evil,,,i'm not buying it. Thats the same as saying Hitler was on a religious conquest during the war.
Leviticus 18:22 - Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.
So far, nobody has been able to prove to me that the Bible (or the Qur'an, or the Torah, or the Bhagavad Gita) was written by God and not by human beings.
I'm no Muslim expert, but unless somebody can scan where the Quran (sp?) stated that Americans were evil,,,i'm not buying it.
Of course 9-11 was a religious and not a political thing. These were suicide attacts. The terrorists gave their lives because they were convinced that they were going to be rewarded in the afterlife.
Joost, I like a decent debate as much as the other person, but I need to concentrate on other things right now. With a topic like this, you have to expect somebody is going to look at it from another perspective. I just dont believe in it and never will. It's ok for us to disagree on this one. No matter what we type or feel, the other will not change their mind. I have to say peace and thanks for your point of view.
Leviticus 18:22 - Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.
Pretty much states its unnatural right there.
Leviticus is the Old Testament. The old covenant. Jesus' teachings are what Christians base their religion on. The New Testament. You are supposed to follow His word. No? There are many things in the Old Testament that Jesus directly contradicts or outright abolishes. For example:
Old Testament: Leviticus 24:19-20: If anyone injures his neighbor, whatever he has done must be done to him: fracture for fracture, eye for eye, tooth for tooth. As he has injured the other, so he is to be injured.
Jesus, on the other hand, stated:
New Testament: Matthew 5:3839: You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. But I tell you, do not resist an evil person.
Also: Hebrews 8:13: In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
Hebrews 8:6-7: Christ has obtained a ministry that is as much more excellent than the old as the covenant he mediates is better than the old covenant, since it is founded on better promises. For if that first covenant had been faultless, there would have been no occasion to look for a second.
The New Testament indicates that Jesus Christ established a new relationship between God and his followers. Where does Jesus mention anything about homosexuality being a sin or an abomination? As a Christian, you need to read Jesus' teachings. From that, you will see that a true Christian is tolerant to ALL people just as Jesus was Himself. Jesus' message was love.
"A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another." -Jesus (John 13:34-35)
If you are kind only to your friends, how are you different from anyone else? -Jesus(Matthew 5:43-47 )
"For if you forgive men for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. "But if you do not forgive men, then your Father will not forgive your transgressions. -Jesus (Matthew 6:14-15)
"So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets." -Jesus(Matthew 7:12)
And my favorite:
"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye. -Jesus (Matthew 7:1-5)
What can be clearer than that?? Any Christian claiming to be justified in hating or turning away others on ANY basis by quoting the Old Testament just does not understand Christianity or Jesus. As a Christian, Jesus' teachings are what you should be following and if there is one thing that Jesus talks about constantly it is TOLERANCE! He teaches his followers to love ALL people and that they are not to judge ANYONE.
From Wiki:
The Old Covenant, containing a single, unified law code, was a legal, conditional covenant requiring perfect and complete obedience of all those under it; that, on the one hand, it promised life to all who obeyed it, and, on the other hand, it pronounced a curse upon all its transgressors; that it, therefore, inescapably brought death to all who sought to be justified by it-- not because of a deficiency in the law (itself "holy, just, and good"), but because of the sinful inability of those under its charge; and that, for this reason, it is variously described as a "killing letter," a "ministry of death, and a "ministry of condemnation" -- its distinct purpose being to illumine sin so as to make manifest the Israelites' and, by implication, all men's need for a redeemer.
In contrast to the Old Covenant, the New Covenant (by virtue of Christ's perfect obedience to the law, as well as His bearing of its curse) promises only blessing to all those who belong to it; and that this second covenant, the "everlasting covenant" enacted upon better promises, has thus brought to realization all that was anticipated in the covenants made with Abraham, Moses, and David.
Under the New Covenant, God's people, having entered the age of fulfillment, now stand as mature sons; that having been set free from the tutelage and bondage of the law code written upon tablets of stone, they have subsequently been placed under the Spirit's management -- having the new and greater Lawgiver's own law now written upon their hearts.
As a result, though many of the individual commandments given in the decalogue and the eternal principles upon which the Mosaic Covenant was founded still apply to those under the New Covenant, God's people are now totally free from the Old Covenant as a covenant; that the usefulness of the Mosaic commands is not therefore to be denied, only that these are now understood to come to us through Christ, the mediator of the New Covenant; and that, in particular, with the obsolescence of the Old Covenant, the fourth commandment, the seventh day Sabbath observance, is no longer obligatory --- its relevance now pointing to that rest enjoyed by all those in Christ.
Joost, I like a decent debate as much as the other person, but I need to concentrate on other things right now. With a topic like this, you have to expect somebody is going to look at it from another perspective. I just dont believe in it and never will. It's ok for us to disagree on this one. No matter what we type or feel, the other will not change their mind. I have to say peace and thanks for your point of view.
OK, that's cool.
Believe whatever you want, all I can do is ask you that if you can't approve of homosexuality, please at least try to tolerate it. Discrimination never leads to anything positive.
I always read Leviticus to be the priestly code and not really applicable to us underlings . Most European christians don't for example go in for male circumcision and the eating of pork and rabbit is wide spread . I don't know anybody that follows whats written in Leviticus to the letter . I can see that incest is wrong . But the rest of it seems arcane to me , i just don't follow the rituals and i doubt many people who call themselves christians do . My family is christian (Methodist) and only one of us is circumcised for medical reasons , so does that mean that the three of us that are intact won't be going to heaven ? as we have not followed that law contained in Leviticus . I come back to The Ten Commandments which does not mention homosexulality and Jesus not mentioning it . Much of what is written in the Bible is the word of man and not the word of god . For me Jesus is the main man and if he does'nt make a judgement on it , neither will i , i will carry on loving my gay friends and all the people i care about . I just refuse to twist my faith into hate .
Yes, i'm homophobic. My opinion on the matter is that its just not natural for two men or two women to be together. The bible states it also and thats enough for me.
I knew somebody once that actually came out and told me they were gay in my own home. He was asked to leave and to never come back, never call, and to never have contact with my children again and he hasent. I dont want my children around that especially in my home. Its bad enough that society pressures everybody into accepting it (along with it being ok to not believe in God), when in truth, they should be pushing for people to get to church. The lack of religion is why the worlds tunring to crap in my opinion.
Ok, feel free to have fun with this now.
You are everything that is wrong with this world. You really have no idea how old-fashioned, ignorant and offensive what you just said is do you? Please, don't say anymore.
On another note, I agree with bluemeanie that coldplay should be banned !!
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DM's Beatles forums › Other forums › Current Affairs › Congrats California on legalising gay marriage!