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[Ydoll Gwyn]

A recent thread involved a little discussion of IN MY LIFE. I visit and post at a few Beatle boards, and have for a few years now. In that time I've seen IN MY LIFE become a very highly-rated and much respected song. Yes, I know it's always been well-regarded, but at the moment it's seen by many as the Beatles' best, and if not, then right up there.

Everyone knows that the politically correct opinion about Pepper has been, for some time now, to regard it as overrated. An important Sixties icon, but musically rather dated and passe. Gladly, that opinion seems to be going out of favor, and Abbey Road (surprisingly after years of adulation) is being looked at as "good, but not that good".

So I'm thinking: what is regarded as "politically correct" Fab opinion at the moment? Notice that I myself couldn't give a fig: you like what you like. However, some folk seem swayed by what's fashionable, and that's what I'm looking for. Here's a short list:

(1) In My Life is a superb song, almost, if not very nearly, flawess.
(2) Early Beatles albums, ESPECIALLY Please Please Me, are fairly ordinary. (This is a lulu, and I shake my head when I read that opinion. Their early albums are full of a dynamic energy which pulsates from the speakers.)
(3) The album LET IT BE is one of their best. (This is a newie. I'm amazed at the frequent praising of what up till recently has been regarded as a poor album by Fab standards.)
(4) Albums can be labelled "Paul" or "John" albums. (Pepper and Revolver are "Paul" albums, Rubber Soul is a "John" album, for instance. My own opinion is that this is bizarre, and a silly way of carrying on the never-ending Paul vs John battle. Only one album can really have such a label stuck on it, as far as I can see and that's Abbey Road. It's one of the reasons I rate Road lowly: it's got far too much of one Beatle's ideas on it.)

What d'ya think? Lay your list on us ...

[Sondra]

I don't know, I think many Beatles fans now put down Let It Be as depressing and messy. Mainly because they now associate it with the break up. It's like, ever since
Anthology and the whole sequence on how depressing the sessions were and Paul putting down Spector's production and putting out Naked, people have jumped on the 'it's subpar' band wagon.

Another thing I think a lot of Beatles fans (and non-Beatles fans) went along with was the whole John is God and Paul is fluff phase. I think it's sort of leveling itself out now though. Sort of.

[tkitna]

One that I can think of is labeling 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' as a masterpiece while I find it long winded and boring and prefer many other George tunes.

'Let It Be' gets capped on more than not and is largely voted as a bad album and maybe their worst. I agree.

'Beatles For Sale' and 'With The Beatles' also gets labeled as above, but I disagree.

The White Album gets voted as their best effort a lot of the times while many of the tunes were written in a solo context. Strange.

'A Day In The Life' is always voted the Beatles greatest song and is mostly regarded as a John song although Paul had a lot to do with it also.

And the biggest myth or fan vote is still-------Yoko broke up the Beatles!

[Bobber]

(1) In My Life is a superb song, almost, if not very nearly, flawess.
(2) Early Beatles albums, ESPECIALLY Please Please Me, are fairly ordinary. (This is a lulu, and I shake my head when I read that opinion. Their early albums are full of a dynamic energy which pulsates from the speakers.)
(3) The album LET IT BE is one of their best. (This is a newie. I'm amazed at the frequent praising of what up till recently has been regarded as a poor album by Fab standards.)
(4) Albums can be labelled "Paul" or "John" albums. (Pepper and Revolver are "Paul" albums, Rubber Soul is a "John" album, for instance. My own opinion is that this is bizarre, and a silly way of carrying on the never-ending Paul vs John battle. Only one album can really have such a label stuck on it, as far as I can see and that's Abbey Road. It's one of the reasons I rate Road lowly: it's got far too much of one Beatle's ideas on it.)

What d'ya think? Lay your list on us ...

1. I agree with your previous posts on In My Life. It's a beautiful song and I like the little pianosolo from George Martin. But especially after John death, this song has got a different dimension. A dimension I never preferred, it's just a beautiful lovesong. And that's it. It's very hard to characterize The Beatles by one single song.

2. Their early albums, let's say up to Help!, shows their skyrocketing ability to write good songs. It's an enormous development they're going through. People often refer to Love Me Do as an ordinairy song. But it was their very first effort and the best they had at that time. In three years, they developed themselves more than any other band. That's my opinion, although the Help!-album is certainly not regarded as their best in this period. I always feel that A Hard Day's Night is somewhat underrated. It's an album full of energy. But yes, overall Please Please Me is regarded as being somewhat ordinairy. Considering the recording time... I always reply that considering that, this is an outburst of everything they had on a single day. A few years ago, With The Beatles was hot. Don't seem to be now.

3. Yes, I read that Let It Be is one of their best albums as well. Don't know why, because it certainly isn't. It's a good attempt in making a great album, but they didn't finish the job properly.

4. Well, read this board. A lot of the discussions are about John vs Paul. Like the old Beatles vs Stones. Yes, they both are great composers in their own way, and yes, their certainly was a competition. But that's exactly the reason why they both wrote great songs. In most cases, it's quite obvious which songs were written by Paul and which by John. The next step is labelling John and Paul to albums. I never regarded Revolver as a Paul-album or as a John-album. It was (and is) a Beatles-album. Sgt Pepper was long regarded as The Beatles at their best: the ultimate cooperation and John and Paul really working together. Since

[Kevin]

The view of Sgt Pepper has changed a lot in my years. Up to '76 it was the greatest piece of music ever, it had almost mythical status (because I suspect concept albums were very much in and this was the daddy). Then came punk and the rebirth of the 3 minute pop song and suddenly Pepper was villified as the root of all evil, the thing that had taken rock from its roots and turned it into a monster. Now its morphed into its current view, an OK piece of music that has become more of a cultural than a musical icon.
 I am surprised by the Let It Be resurrection. I come from that generation when it was against the law to like it, and I think that has tainted my opinion for ever.
I'm also surprised by how much their soft songs are preferred over the rockers etc. (Judging by polls on this board). I've always been a little embarrassed by Let it Be (the song), Yesterday, and even In My Life, and I thought that was normal. Obviously not. IML just doesn't do it for me - too much of a melody, too much vocals in the mix and I don't care for the lyric. It's all just too pretty. But again I conceed that my opinion does not reflect the general trend.

I have trouble with Please Please Me (the album). It just sounds so dated. I think I have to hear it next to some contempary releases to see if it was a "breath of fresh air".
With The Beatles and AHDN-now we're talking, bettered only by the Rubber Soul/Revolver combo. They do seem to get dismissed, but maybe they too just belong to another era that doesn't please modern ears.

[An Apple Beatle]

It's a good probing question Ydoll. I can't say that I recieve Beatles in a way that can be deemed fashionable. I agree with so much of what all of you have very well said. In particular Bobber. Tk's comment on WMGGW and Yoko.

There is no labelling albums and persona's when it really comes down to it. I just mainly get the buzz off appreciating it's diversity, their response to technology, their choice of chords in relation to their age of writing and their creative and personal condition at the time. (If that makes sense?)

There is so many ways to appreciate The Beatles that I have never thought of a 'politically correct' opinion. Whenever there is a tired opinion someone comes along and creates a new one. I guess I'm just really not aware of current trends of opinion regarding The Beatles.

I'd never personally call In My Life The Beatles best. It could be close to being their most sentimentally strongest connection with the majority of their listeners. It's a song that conjures up that kind of reminiscence and reflection in some people.

Let It BE is certainly not their best. I found myself thinking that when I first got into it for a while. Mainly due th the fact it was fresh and amongst my friends at the time....rare.

I agree with most of point 4 Ydoll but I'm sure you'll know where I differ in your opinion. Reeking of Paul or not, (Abbey Rd.) for me, it's a summise of their time together. As in...That's all WE can give you. So I don't find that the album is ruined because of that(Massive threads elsewhere on this). They were four kids who were parting as men. 'Fair Play to em' as they might say down your way Ydoll. Or perhaps 'fair dinkum'? lol

My taste a little wanes as we go earlier with The Beatles but I still appreciate their energy and musicianship. It's more reason to think how remarkable they were at what they did. True, young passion. Where I'm at right now is mainly later albums but with the odd look at Help & AHDN I suppose. I still have a lot of anthology and other stuff to digest more really. Another bearing on how fans receive The BEatles is to ask what was available when you were first interested in The Beatles. No anthologies for me but there was the Red and Blue albums.

What fans like? It's to do with age, exposure to songs, personal experiences, other music. There is the first rush of discovering The Beatles and then (For me) a steady, hopefully balanced, appreciation of The Beatles. Discovering they were not perfect. Digging deeper. They are all things to all men. So many performers/bands/acts/lyricists fall down on that hurdle. They overcame it and pushed the boundaries till THEY were the ones setting the height. I cannay say it better than that really.

They were The legendary, history making Beatles and they were also just 4 mateys from Liverpool who got well jammy!!!! I love it!!!

[Yamisonic]

I made one of those John vs Paul things, but I didnt make it as a battle, as I said in my post. I actually think the early albums are the best -- Please Please Me, Hard Days Night, those two are two of my favourites. I like more songs off the early period than the late period.

[Ydoll Gwyn]

Great posts, everybody. I enjoyed reading what everyone had to say. I can assure folks that In My Life regularly tops song polls, or nearly tops them recently. Also, many new fans (especially) seem to be rapt in the LIB album (or, LIBN).

Kevin_b said one thing that I have noticed too:

I'm also surprised by how much their soft songs are preferred over the rockers etc.

That is so true. I have wondered if the sort of new fan that the Beatles attract is not interested in their rock or their psychedelic music, but simply their ballads and softer music. On this very board, and at beatlelinks.com, I have seen Martha My Dear strongly & enthusiastically praised! Lordy: I think it's one of the more disposable pieces of the White Album, and honestly can't see its "greatness".

[Sondra]

Martha My Dear? Ewww. I guess I'm off on this Let It Be thing. I don't know, I never hear people really putting it up there with there best or anything. Especially among long time Beatles fans. They're usually the ones who know the whole history of it and let that taint their opinion of it. At least that's my perception. Mainly because they usually follow with a brief history of what went on and what went wrong. I think that affects their judgement. They don't look at it for what it is. I think they went back to their roots and sort of stripped down to the basics. Very simple, straightforward rock. Which tends to be less polished. Unlike Abbey Road which sounds very clean and polished. More of what fans expect from them. The whole ending of Abbey Road is a bit bloated and dramatic. Which is great though. I mean, I do like that kinda stuff sometimes.

[In Blue Hawaii]

Lordy: I think it's one of the more disposable pieces of the White Album, and honestly can't see its "greatness".

: shrug : Different strokes, I guess.

I personally love the song because of Paul's all-around playing (piano, drums, bass, guitar). Being a bit of a musician myself, it is much more challenging to figure out the piano part of "Martha, My Dear" than any other song on the White album. 0:00 - 0:19 is one of the coolest Paul piano lick I've ever heard. Subtle string and horns arrangement all througout. The sound of Paul's Fender bass doubled with tuba especially on 1:20 - 1:38 is  just so cool.

Cool..ya dig?  

[Kevin]

^ I too really like the arrangement on Martha. A very nicely constructed song - probably my favourite dog song. ("Shannon" comes in at number two)

[lennonlemon]

I agree with a lot of points that Ydoll makes with a few exceptions.

I've personally never considered "in My Life" to be their greatest works or usually wouldn't even consider it in my top 10 beatles songs. The harpischord is great, but the vocals jsut don't do it for me.

I am a fan of their early albums and consider Please Please Me and Help! to be some of their greatest works. You juut don't get to many songs that elicit energy like "I Saw Her Stnading There" (which happens to be one of my favorite Beatles songs of all-time). Although I don't think their early works are superior to, say, Revolver or the White Album, they are definetly not ordinary.

My opinion of Let it Be is similar very much so to how I feel about Abbey Road. I do enjoy them once in a while and they contain a few of my favorite Beatle tunes, but overall the albums are ordinary, containing many mediocre songs.

I've heard a few say that "Let it Be" or "Abbey Road" was Paul's first "solo" album or things like that, but never really considered them to be, myself. All members of the band contributed and although some may have been more enthusiastic about the project; I don't think it's right to label it a "John" or "Paul" album.

Finally, I must agree with Ydoll about "Martha My Dear." I never warmed up to the song and the beginning lick reminds me of some wild west saloon, which always makes me giggle.

If I may say something, two songs I never cared much for, but many Beatles fans consider to be some of their greatest work is Hey Jude and Yesterday. I just don't get it.

[An Apple Beatle]

: shrug : Different strokes, I guess.

I personally love the song because of Paul's all-around playing (piano, drums, bass, guitar). Being a bit of a musician myself, it is much more challenging to figure out the piano part of "Martha, My Dear" than any other song on the White album. 0:00 - 0:19 is one of the coolest Paul piano lick I've ever heard. Subtle string and horns arrangement all througout. The sound of Paul's Fender bass doubled with tuba especially on 1:20 - 1:38 is

[Harrison]

2. Their early albums, let's say up to Help!, shows their skyrocketing ability to write good songs. It's an enormous development they're going through.

I disagree with you here.

1. In My Life is such a wonderful song and has alot of sentimental value to me. I think part of its brilliance is that it is simply stated but says so much. Its like how you see more character in a black and white photo rather than a digital/colour picture with every single image laid out.

2.The early albums are priceless, and each shows an incredible progression in both musical and lyrical content.  That's not to say that 'Beatles For Sale' is better than 'Please Please Me' because it was released later. Each album is unto its own as far as I'm concerned, each is unique and must be thought of this way.

3."Let It Be" is a great album. So you have some throwaways, big deal, hell, I'd rather have them than not.  Given the circumstances that it was recorded under, the animosity within the group, being video'd at Twickenham, etc., its amazing that they were able to produce anything. There is one thing that was never an issue, and that was the incredible chemistry that happened when the four were making music, and even under massive strain, they were able to put together alot of great music.

4. I don't believe that there were any 'John or Paul' albums, though I can appreciate side 2 of Abbey Road being considered Paul's.  To peg a 'John' or 'Paul' label on Rubber Soul or Revolver is ludicrous, and the only way I can see how someone would myopically say that is that they like John's songs better on one LP or Paul's.  There was a ton of give and take during that period, and George was beginning to get his songs in as well.

[An Apple Beatle]

. The sound of Paul's Fender bass doubled with tuba especially on 1:20 - 1:38 is

[In Blue Hawaii]

Does he use a Fender on it? Jazz? Precision? I never knew that. I got a precision. I'm gonna like it even more than I already do now. lol

I made a mistake Paul used his Ric. Gorgeous Ric.

[Heart]

Music just is. You dont always have to pick a favorite.

[An Apple Beatle]

I made a mistake Paul used his Ric. Gorgeous Ric.

LOL....I did wonder. That Riccy is gorgeous. So do you know of any songs that he did use a Fender for? I'm interested to know....I'm gonna have to go research on this.

[An Apple Beatle]

This is all I could find about Paul using a Fender.

http://www.songfacts.com/detail.lasso?id=177


.....Not a lot!!! lol