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Author Topic: Hatred towards Mike Love ??  (Read 12639 times)

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fendertele

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Hatred towards Mike Love ??
« on: July 23, 2009, 09:01:54 PM »

Maybe Joost or someone alse may be able to tell me why there is such a hatred for Mike Love ? see so many youtube comments on there videos and people tearing into him

I personally think his voice is great on the early stuff and very distinct got a certain coolness to it, and his dance moves actually liven up there live stuff as the other guys are quite wooden except for the occasional synchronized move or two.

I take it a lot of it is due to him using the Beach boys name when touring and not allowing Jardine to do so ? and maybe the story of his not giving his daughter money for a life saving operation ?

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Mairi

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Re: Hatred towards Mike Love ??
« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2009, 09:36:50 PM »

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pc31

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Re: Hatred towards Mike Love ??
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2009, 09:39:08 PM »

Maybe Joost or someone alse may be able to tell me why there is such a hatred for Mike Love ? see so many youtube comments on there videos and people tearing into him

I personally think his voice is great on the early stuff and very distinct got a certain coolness to it, and his dance moves actually liven up there live stuff as the other guys are quite wooden except for the occasional synchronized move or two.

I take it a lot of it is due to him using the Beach boys name when touring and not allowing Jardine to do so ? and maybe the story of his not giving his daughter money for a life saving operation ?


dennis wilson had a love child with mike loves daughter...he may have been married to her...it was her in the picture dennis was diving for at the dock when he drowned i think...he was mad at dennis and treated him like sh*t...so people may remember he had a less than favorable opinion of dennis...i don't care much for cousin mike myself....come on cracker learn to play an instument... >:(
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Joost

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Re: Hatred towards Mike Love ??
« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2009, 06:35:29 AM »

dennis wilson had a love child with mike loves daughter...he may have been married to her...it was her in the picture dennis was diving for at the dock when he drowned i think...he was mad at dennis and treated him like sh*t...so people may remember he had a less than favorable opinion of dennis...i don't care much for cousin mike myself....come on cracker learn to play an instument... >:(

Dennis did have a child with and was married to Mike's illegimate daughter Shawn (who Mike never recognized). It wasn't her though on the picture he was diving for, that was Karen Lamm (who Dennis had been married to twice and was really the love of his life). Shawn and Dennis were already living apart at the time of his death and were in the process of getting divorced.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2009, 08:30:29 AM by Joost »
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Joost

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Re: Hatred towards Mike Love ??
« Reply #4 on: July 24, 2009, 07:23:28 AM »

About the hatred towards Mike Love:

Mike Love certainly isn't my favorite Beach Boy, but a lot of the things that are being said about him are either too black and white or just plain lies. A lot of the claims in the blog that Mairi posted are nonsense.

The reasons why I think many people hate Mike Love:
* The Wilson brothers were progressive thinkers who saw music as an art form. Mike on the other hand was more of a salesman type of person who saw music as a product and just wanted to sell as many records as possible. That's why he tried to talk Brian out of doing 'Pet Sounds' and 'Smile' and told him to stick to the successful old formula.
* Mike Love likes to make himself seem more important than he really was. One example: 'Good Vibrations' was 99% Brian's work. He slaved on it for months to get it exactly right. But Mike will tell you that it was a hit thanks to him, cause after all, it was Dr. Love (yes, he really refers to himself like that) who came with the idea of giving the song a simple boy-girl lyric so that everyone could relate to the song despite of all it's weirdness. He really seems to think that way.

But in his defense:
* Mike was important. The Beach Boys are best known for the way they portrayed California as a sunny paradise where it's all about girls, beaches and cars, right? Well, that was Mike's imput. Brian didn't care for all that stuff, Mike was much more in touch with the interests of their peers. It's like Bruce Johnston once said: "If Brian was the shy, introverted guy in school, then Mike was Mr. Cool who'd tell him how to ask girls out - and that's what Mike did for Brian's music".
* And can you image any of the other Beach Boys singing 'I Get Around' or 'Fun Fun Fun' with the same allure as Mike?
* People often saw Mike as the guy who was bullying the Wilsons, but that's really not fair. You've got to realize that the Wilsons were heavy alcoholics and drug addicts (yes, even Carl, he could just hide it better than his brothers) and very hard to deal with. Mike tried cannabis for a short while in the late 60s but stayed sober ever since.
* Mike and Dennis grew up together and had a very intense love-hate kind of relationship ever since they were children. Sometimes they were the best friends in the world, sometimes they'd have fistfights. Whenever they had one, it was usually Dennis who took the first swing. And once again, Dennis Wilson was incredibly hard to deal with. He was a heavy alcoholic and drug addict, who sometimes went on stage totally wasted. On top of that, he had a very short fuse, he could be a terrible prick and he slept with at least one of Mike's wives... I can't really blame Mike for getting mad at Dennis every once in a while.

About the claims in the blog that Mairi linked to:

He apparently beat his wife.
I've read one story about Mike beating his wife (because she was smoking after she said she'd quit). And about a dozen about Dennis beating one of his wives/girlfriends.

He rewrote the Leiber/Stoller song “Riot in Cell Block 9″ into the song “Student Demonstration Time”, which sucks ass, yet somehow made it onto the Surf’s Up album while excellent songs by Dennis such as “4th of July” and “Fallin’ in Love” stayed in the can.
Dennis's songs were not rejected. He withdrew them himself after a fallout he had with Carl. It was his own choice, Mike had nothing to do with it. In fact, almost every single that the Beach Boys released ever since Dennis started to emerge as a songwriter features a Dennis Wilson composition on either the A or the B side. So it's not like they tried to belittle his talents. And 'Falling In Love' was never going to be on 'Surf's Up' to begin with, Dennis had already released it on a solo single a year earlier.
'Student Demonstration Time' does suck ass by the way.

'His cousin Stan, along with Rocky Pamplin, kicked down Dennis’ door and beat the sh*t out of him, messing up his larnyx and ruining his voice.'
Again, Mike had nothing to do with that. Stan Love (who, for the record, is Mike's brother and therefor a cousin of the Wilsons) and Rocky Pamplin were hired to look after Brian, who was a complete mess at the time. Dennis kept giving Brian drugs while he was trying to quit, so Stan and Rocky decided to teach him a lesson. They went too far and were eventually prosecuted.

He really got into transcendental meditation, and just wouldn’t stop writing sh*tty songs about it.
He wrote a few songs about it, not that many. Brian also wrote TM songs. And so did The Beatles. And two of the TM-songs that Mike co-wrote, 'All This Is That' and 'All I Wanna Do', are actually among the prettiest songs that the Beach Boys ever recorded.

He pushed a very obviously mentally ill and terrified Brian onstage as part of the “Brian’s Back!” campaign, and even wrote a song called “Brian’s Back” in which he pretended to like him.
It maybe wasn't a very good idea that they dragged him back on stage, but at least they got him out of his reclusion for a while. And Brian was actually doing relatively well around that time. The next Beach Boys album, 'The Beach Boys Love You', was almost a Brian Wilson solo effort - he wrote many of the songs on his own (he'd rarely written without a collaborator in the past) and even played almost all of the instruments.
And it's unfair to say that Mike didn't like Brian. They grew up together, they hung out all the time when they were in their teens, they've known each other all their lives. It's not too hard to believe that he really cared about him. Even though 'Brian's Back' probably isn't the most tasteful song ever written.

He’s an alleged racist.
That's an outright lie that was fabricated by Eugene Landy, who had his personal reasons for keeping Brian away from the other Beach Boys. Mike has been married to a Japanese woman. The Beach Boys had two black South-African band members in the mid 70s. And Mike is a big fan of Chuck Berry and Fats Domino. Doesn't sound like a racist to me.

He’s a right-wing Republican, but he did give $5000 in start-up capital to Tipper Gore to start up the PMRC to censor pop music.
He's not right-wing, he's just a conservative like a whole lot of other Americans. And Brian voted for McCain last year. So what?

He created a TV miniseries full of revisionist history to glorify his own contributions to the band and take credit for a lot of things he never actually did. He also used it to give the impression that John Lennon wanted to jam with him, although Lennon is quoted as calling him a “jerk”.
Yeah, that was a disgrace.

He sued Brian over songwriting credits he claimed he never received, which might have been due to his not actually having done the songwriting he claims to have done.
It should be noted that Murry Wilson, the dad of the Wilson brothers and the band's first manager, was an even bigger bully than Mike. Often he simply neglected to give nephew Mike his due credit. So for a long time, Brian got a lot of money that should've gone to Mike.

He keeps suing poor Al every time he tries to tour.
He doesn't, he just sued him because Al used the Beach Boys' name while Mike owns the exclusive license to do that. And that license was given (or sold, I'm not sure) to him by BRI, the legal branch of The Beach Boys of which Mike, Al, Brian and Carl's estate are equal owners. Al was just outvoted - likely for the simple reason that Mike is to date the only original Beach Boy who never left the touring band (and didn't die). As long as Al doesn't use the Beach Boys' name, he can tour his ass off if he wants to. Nothing that Mike can do about that, even if he wanted to.

He was a real dick to lyricist Van Dyke Parks during the Smile era
He just asked Parks what the lyrics that he was supposed to sing meant, which I think is fair. Parks then said that he didn't have a clue (he writes his lyrics to create an athmosphere, not necessarily to really say something) and Mike just didn't dig that.

and even 20 years later, took a cheap shot at him on the “Wipeout” single the Beach Boys did with the Fat Boys.
How? The only Beach Boy who sings on 'Wipe Out' is Brian Wilson...

He went on a drunken, bizarre, classless rant when the band was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, calling out the Beatles, Mick Jagger, Billy Joel, Bruce Springsteen, the Supremes, and possibly the MC5, for no discernible reason.
Yes, that was very embarrassing. The given reason was that he couldn't think straight due to an ill-advised fast.

His solo albums suck, even for Beach Boys solo albums, which mostly kind of suck to start with.
First of all: he released just one solo album. And it sure does suck, but so do both of Carl Wilson's solo albums and some of Brian's.

He is responsible for “Kokomo”. And he’s proud of it.
He's not responsible, it was mostly written by John Phillips and Scott McKenzie. Mike only added the "Aruba, Jamaica..." line. And even if he was responsible for it, why shouldn't he be proud? It was their first #1 hit in 22 years!

He’s still alive, while Dennis and Carl are dead.
Yeah well... Health fanatics often live longer than reckless alcoholics (Dennis) and chainsmokers (Carl).

I hope this sets some things straight...
« Last Edit: July 24, 2009, 12:49:43 PM by Joost »
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fendertele

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Re: Hatred towards Mike Love ??
« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2009, 02:36:26 PM »

nice reply man and nice to see some facts too ;) a personally think he was crucial to them in the early days distinctive voice and a really cool character amongst what you could call nerdy shy guys and if he hadsnt been on stage singing with them they would look quite dull and i really like his voice aswell.

But is it true about him not giving his daughter the money for an operation that could have saved her life ?
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Mairi

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Re: Hatred towards Mike Love ??
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2009, 04:10:15 PM »

Thanks Joost, that was very informative! We can always count on you for Beach Boys facts.
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Joost

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Re: Hatred towards Mike Love ??
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2009, 04:29:35 PM »

But is it true about him not giving his daughter the money for an operation that could have saved her life ?

She died a few years ago, but I don't know if she could've been saved if someone would have paid for an operation. Another rumor is that she could've been saved with her father's bone marrow. But for all I know those are all just rumors.

And you'd think that Shawn always had some money, because legally she was still Dennis's wife at the time of his death so I guess she always had some income from Beach Boys royalties... Unless she sold her rights earlier, I don't know if she did that... I do know that Mike never recognized her as his daughter and wanted nothing to do with her.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2009, 05:23:40 PM by Joost »
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Mairi

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Re: Hatred towards Mike Love ??
« Reply #8 on: July 24, 2009, 05:50:46 PM »

What a messy, sordid affair that whole thing was.
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Joost

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Re: Hatred towards Mike Love ??
« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2009, 07:12:44 PM »

Now that I'm reading my post again (that really long one), I realize that it makes Dennis Wilson look like a complete bastard. Maybe he was in a way (he had a short fuse, he was a prick, he slept with his friends' and even his brothers' wives and underaged girls), but I believe that he really wasn't such a bad guy. I've read and heard a lot of comments from people who know Dennis personally and it seems that everybody loved him despite all his flaws. He must have been a very warm, friendly, generous, talented and charismatic guy. A guy who could light up a room with his presence, and who people just couldn't stay mad at.
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