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Author Topic: Religion  (Read 12933 times)

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An Apple Beatle

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Re: Religion
« Reply #60 on: February 16, 2006, 12:44:08 PM »

This'll do me.......


Desiderata

Go placidly amid the noise and haste,
and remember what peace there may be in silence.
As far as possible without surrender
be on good terms with all persons.
Speak your truth quietly and clearly;
and listen to others,
even the dull and the ignorant;
they too have their story.

Avoid loud and aggressive persons,
they are vexations to the spirit.
If you compare yourself with others,
you may become vain and bitter;
for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself.
Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans.


Keep interested in your own career, however humble;
it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time.
Exercise caution in your business affairs;
for the world is full of trickery.
But let this not blind you to what virtue there is;
many persons strive for high ideals;
and everywhere life is full of heroism.


Be yourself.
Especially, do not feign affection.
Neither be cynical about love;
for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment
it is as perennial as the grass.


Take kindly the counsel of the years,
gracefully surrendering the things of youth.
Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune.
But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings.
Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness.
Beyond a wholesome discipline,
be gentle with yourself.


You are a child of the universe,
no less than the trees and the stars;
you have a right to be here.
And whether or not it is clear to you,
no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.


Therefore be at peace with God,
whatever you conceive Him to be,
and whatever your labors and aspirations,
in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.


With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams,
it is still a beautiful world.
Be cheerful.
Strive to be happy.


Max Ehrmann, Desiderata, Copyright 1952
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Mean_Mr_Mustard

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Re: Religion
« Reply #61 on: February 16, 2006, 01:21:05 PM »

Quote from: kevin_b

I have to say though that deducing that because science can't explain the beginnining of the universe that that means a "higher intelligence" did it doesn't seem remarkably logical to me.
A logical answer would be "I don't know."
But us stupid humans always have to have an answer (whether it be science or religion.)  :)

ps - my doubts about science only extend to the creation bit. I'm with it pretty much 100% on everything else.

Of course we worry about something we probably will never know, And something that isnt so important anyways.
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Kevin

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Re: Religion
« Reply #62 on: February 16, 2006, 01:32:25 PM »

Quote from: Mean_Mr_Mustard

Of course we worry about something we probably will never know, And something that isnt so important anyways.

But don't you wanna know?
I'm 50 in 3 years, and maybe mortality and the like is becoming more of an issue for me now. I would kind of like to know why I was here. If it is just sex and death, then fair enough. I've done my bit for the species.
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Mairi

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Re: Religion
« Reply #63 on: February 16, 2006, 03:58:07 PM »

I think that the reason we were put on this earth is to love and be loved (not just in the romantic sense). That's my goal in life, to love as many people as possible and to do things that will make people want to love me.
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Sondra

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Re: Religion
« Reply #64 on: February 16, 2006, 09:40:29 PM »

Quote from: kevin_b

How? (and remember, proof please, not hearsay and assumption.)
Because, by your reasoning, if you can't that proves they do.

Because we know it was a made up character by some imaginative writer who never claimed it was based on anything real. As far as i know anyway. Just like I don't think Mary Poppins is a real person who can actually fly. And when did I ever say if you can't prove something then it does exist? I said you can't say one way or the other with certainty. Isn't that just common sense? Not just 'my reasoning?"

BTW, I never said I believed in God. I wouldn't assume a person does just because they don't happen to buy into the same philosophy as to why he doesn't.
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number14

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Re: Religion
« Reply #65 on: February 17, 2006, 12:12:39 AM »

I am a christian and also a mormon , I am curious to see what you guys think of Mormons
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tkitna

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Re: Religion
« Reply #66 on: February 17, 2006, 12:30:40 AM »

Quote from: number14
I am a christian and also a mormon , I am curious to see what you guys think of Mormons

I only know of three mormons and thats Steve Young, Danny Ainge, and Shawn Bradley and they were all good athletes.

somedude210

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Re: Religion
« Reply #67 on: February 17, 2006, 03:01:17 AM »

funny how so many worship some guy that is said to be the son of some "God", so could we come up with a religion based on Lennon even though he was real and his actions are recorded and his life is real. so why do millions not worship the ground he walked on, but those same million are still willing to worship the ground of some random guy who lived 2032 years ago and was basically the same martyr as those like Ghandi? wheres the religions for them? wheres the glory in what they did? wheres the worshipping for those that were known to be ordinary people doing extraordinary things? just one of those things that will never be figured out i guess.

go humanist and try and improve the world as much as you can in your short lifespan
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Mean_Mr_Mustard

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Re: Religion
« Reply #68 on: February 17, 2006, 06:26:35 AM »

Quote from: kevin_b

But don't you wanna know?
I'm 50 in 3 years, and maybe mortality and the like is becoming more of an issue for me now. I would kind of like to know why I was here. If it is just sex and death, then fair enough. I've done my bit for the species.


To me its not very important, either way if I know or dont know, I am still here.

About Mormons I talked to them for a while for fun (was never going to convert) They are really nice the ones I met. But when they started to realize I was never going to convert they started to get kind of jerky (some of them) which made me think their niceness was just an act to get me to convert. (Trying to be nice all the time basically saying "Look how nice we are, you should convert.) I am sorry nobody is happy about everything all the time.  ;D
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Kevin

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Re: Religion
« Reply #69 on: February 17, 2006, 09:36:00 AM »

Quote from: Maccalvr

Because we know it was a made up character by some imaginative writer who never claimed it was based on anything real. As far as i know anyway. Just like I don't think Mary Poppins is a real person who can actually fly. And when did I ever say if you can't prove something then it does exist? I said you can't say one way or the other with certainty. Isn't that just common sense? Not just 'my reasoning?"

 

Hello. Sorry if I misread you. It's just that the old "you can't prove it's not true so it is" line is dragged out so many times. Believers in ghosts and UFO's use the same line.
Bram Stoker didn't make up vampires - there are accounts of them in almost every culture going back thousands of years. Many rural populations still have a strong belief in them. People claim to have been them, seen them etc.
Yet we, as rational, logical people, know they don't exist, even though no-one can conclusively prove they don't.
I don't expect religious people to prove God's existance. Just don't used that warped line of logic.
Sorry if I go on but this is a topic dear to my heart, and I don't often get a chance to vent. Hope it's all taken in good spirit. (I'm actually quite pro-religion you know.)
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Kevin

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Re: Religion
« Reply #70 on: February 17, 2006, 09:45:35 AM »

Quote from: somedude210
funny how so many worship some guy that is said to be the son of some "God", so could we come up with a religion based on Lennon even though he was real and his actions are recorded and his life is real. so why do millions not worship the ground he walked on, ? just one of those things that will never be figured out i guess.


Ummm. I can only guess that it's because Lennon was a muscian and Ghandhi a politician. Dieification normally requires something a bit special - walking on water, speaking to God, the odd miracle, rising from the dead...that sort of thing. I don't think making a handful of great albums and lying in bed for a week qualifies.
Though Elvis is getting close.  :)
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Bobber

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Re: Religion
« Reply #71 on: February 17, 2006, 09:47:25 AM »

Quote from: An_Apple_Beatle
This'll do me.......


Desiderata


I've read that before, it said it was found in a church in Boston round 1563 or so. Whatever, it resembles pretty much what it's about imo.
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Joost

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Re: Religion
« Reply #72 on: February 17, 2006, 03:51:18 PM »

Quote from: kevin_b
Believers in ghosts and UFO's use the same line.

That's actually also one of the reasons why I believe in God - I really believe in ghosts, which automatically means that I believe that souls can excist without a body.

And, about the soul without the body thing: your molecules are constantly being renewed, and it takes seven years for all the moleclules in your body to be renewed. So you don't have a single molecule in your body that was already there seven years ago. But your soul's still here. Which means that in a way, your soul has already survived your body.  ;D
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Mairi

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Re: Religion
« Reply #73 on: February 17, 2006, 04:04:13 PM »

Quote from: somedude210
funny how so many worship some guy that is said to be the son of some "God", so could we come up with a religion based on Lennon even though he was real and his actions are recorded and his life is real. so why do millions not worship the ground he walked on, but those same million are still willing to worship the ground of some random guy who lived 2032 years ago and was basically the same martyr as those like Ghandi? wheres the religions for them? wheres the glory in what they did? wheres the worshipping for those that were known to be ordinary people doing extraordinary things? just one of those things that will never be figured out i guess.

Little things like walking on water, healing the sick, turning water into wine, etc... those might be the clinchers.
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Kevin

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Re: Religion
« Reply #74 on: February 17, 2006, 04:19:22 PM »

^ Curse you Biscuitpower for turning my science against me.
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Indica

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Re: Religion
« Reply #75 on: February 17, 2006, 05:52:07 PM »

Quote from: Mairi

Little things like walking on water, healing the sick, turning water into wine, etc... those might be the clinchers.

That's the sort of stuff I just can't seem to agree with :-/
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Kevin

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Re: Religion
« Reply #76 on: February 17, 2006, 05:53:31 PM »

Quote from: IndicaWalrus

That's the sort of stuff I just can't seem to agree with :-/

The damn thing is we can't prove he didn't.
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Indica

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Re: Religion
« Reply #77 on: February 17, 2006, 05:55:00 PM »

haha, I know.
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somedude210

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Re: Religion
« Reply #78 on: February 17, 2006, 07:55:14 PM »

Quote from: Mairi

Little things like walking on water, healing the sick, turning water into wine, etc... those might be the clinchers.

ya but all that was documented 300 years his death. which would mean that all the witnesses would be 6 feet under and the writers weren't even born. those "miracles" could solely be just a story. its just one of those things that you want so badly to believe but in the end, its just a really good and creative story...that has started countless wars.

eh, ive just lost the faith in religion that others have. i dont understand those that live a deeply religious lifestyle and they don't understand why i dont mind "burning in hell". you just have to live for what you have, let someone else worry about what to do in 50 years when you die
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Mairi

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Re: Religion
« Reply #79 on: February 17, 2006, 08:49:15 PM »

I'm not saying that we should follow religion blindly, (far from it) but when it comes down to it, religion is a personal thing and you shouldn't judge people or look down on them for what they believe in. Both sides can tend to have a holier-than-thou attitude ("You don't believe in God? You heathen! You'll burn in hell!" vs. "You believe in God? Haha! You moron! You'll just be worm food after you die!") In the end, it's all about love, and as long as nobody's getting hurt, what gives you the right to critisize other's beliefs? I don't believe everything I read in the bible (Adam and Eve, in my opinion, is most likely a parable that got confused for fact after being translated) but if someone else wants to... hey, that's their choice.

In any case, it's like Sandra said. It's not about proof. It's about faith. if I never find a human being who loves me, it won't matter becaus I know that Jesus loves me. And why would you want to take that away from someone? So you can feel better about yourself?

If you ask me, the world hasn't progressed much since Jesus died. Sure, we have cell phones and iPods and laptops, but we still lie, cheat and steal. You think that religion plays too much of a part in politics, but the fact is that religion plays a huge part in life for many people. Deal with it. Chastising someone for believing in God is as stupid as chastising someone because they DON'T believe in God.
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